The Startup CPG Podcast

01:35 Jessi - Hi Renee, hi Joel, so glad to have you here today. How are you both?

03:22 Renee - Good, thanks for having us, Jessi.

3:27 Jessi - Yeah, great to have you both here. I would love if you could start off by just telling us a little bit about you, Renée, maybe you start us off, tell us a little bit about yourself and your brand and then we'll jump to an introduction for Joel.

03:37 Renee - For sure. So I'm Renée, I'm the founder and CEO of Amazi. We make innovative tropical fruit snacks, all three simple ingredients featuring fruits like jackfruit, pineapple, plantains in new and accessible ways. But one of the most unique things about us is that we are partnering with farmers and small businesses in Uganda to produce all of our products through this partnership model. We have a vertically integrated supply chain and we're on a mission to help you snack on purpose. And that's where Joel comes in as well. So I will let him jump in right there.

04:08 Joel - Yes, thank you. I'm Joel, I'm an operations manager down here in Uganda for a company called Negonja Organics. We are the partners of Amazi that produce the products that she wants everyone to snack on on purpose. Yeah, so I run the operations, but yeah.

04:27 Jessi - I love it. And I am a big fan of the Amazi products myself. I got to meet Renée in person at Expo West this year and got to try a bunch of the products. But so far I'm partial to the dried pineapple with moringa and hibiscus. Renée sent me some and then I ate the bag in one sitting and then I just had to go on the website and order a whole other case of it. And I think that's already disappeared too. So all the products are delicious though and unique. And yeah, I'm a huge pineapple fan in particular. So it's so fun to get to actually try the products and see how unique and tasty that they are.

05:15 Renee - Thank you so much. And I think so much of that is due to our production at Source model. I think we're able to really capture the flavors of these fruits. You know, peak ripeness, super fresh. And I think that's the like, yay for us side of the model, of course. You know, there's the impact side of things. But the yay for us side as consumers is that it tastes so much better. So thank you. I'm so glad that you can taste the difference. That's awesome. Great.

05:44 Jessi - So yeah, I definitely want to dig into kind of the, you know, production supply chain. Can you first also just kind of let us know like the stage that Amazi is at? Like how many retail doors are you in? Maybe some of your major retailers? How many total employees do you have? And you know, maybe what that looks like split between the US and how many people in Uganda are working on the brand as well?

06:07 Renee - Definitely. So we're a scrappy brand. I've been personally working on Amazi for seven years now. But it took me quite some time to first establish our initial partnership, initial products. And we launched this partnership with Joel and his team in 2019. So that was kind of like our start date in my mind. Since then, we've launched with partners like Sprouts, Wegmans, we're in Giant. We're also in select Foxtrot stores in the DC area, not all the markets. And we're also in airport markets such as like Sebo Express with OTG. We do some hotels, some offices. So yeah, that's kind of where we're at. In terms of team, very lean, like I said, on the side in the US, it's me full time and then I have my ops manager Nate, and I have an admin assistant named Mika. And that's basically it. And then on the Uganda side, though, Joel, I'll let you fill in but the management team is Joel, Charlotte and Stephen. They are kind of our OG people that we found and built this partnership with and they lead the way. And Joel, I don't know how many employees would you say are regularly on staff? I know they fluctuate a little bit between when they're in peak production versus not. So Joel, maybe you can shed some light on the ranges there.

07:31 Joel - Thank you. We have 30 permanent employees on staff. We have regular permanent. Then we do have all the casual workers. These come in basically depending on the size of the order, filling the gaps here and there. And those usually range from about 100 to let's say about 100 to 150. That's the usual range.

07:56 Renee - Yeah, when I've been there in person, I go in person at least once a year. When I was starting the company was more often. But when I go and it's peak production, it's certainly buzzing. They're running a buzzing facility over there. And it's awesome to see just lots of lots of people there.

08:17 Jessi - Yeah, yeah, that's awesome. So how did you how did the two of you first connect? Like you mentioned that that was back in 2019. So what did that look like? Because I believe Renee that you have gone on like you had initially gone to Uganda. And that was part of what inspired you to start the company. So what did it look like for the two of you to meet and decide to really like, you know, set up this kind of production partnership?

08:38 Renee - Yeah. So Joel, I'll start and then you're welcome to add your side of the story. But I, his impression of this crazy person. But I was I did start the company before meeting Joel and it's actually his father Stephen is the one of our other partners that I mentioned. And I was studying abroad in Uganda when I was in college, I got my thesis grant, I got a grant to go back and do my thesis research there. I was studying entrepreneurship, speaking with local entrepreneurs and growers and was just really struck by the lack of market access, as well as the very high levels of unemployment. And beyond that, the incredible fruit. So every time I would come home, I would like smuggle back snacks from Uganda. And I was like, Oh, I wonder if there would be a way that we could make these and encourage more local industry and allow the people at the source to actually be involved in the value addition as opposed to being completely disconnected from the process, which is how most of our supply chain exists. And at first, what I did was I would find people who were already drying fruit to kind of start to develop recipes, start to figure out how that works. But it became pretty clear within a couple years that we needed partners that really wanted to be partners and help us build this like streamlined supply chain, not just in terms of quality and scale, but also in terms of the transparency that we needed to achieve the level of impact that we were wanting to create. I think with working with third party producers, there's always a level of opaqueness where you don't really see if the farmers are being paid on time, how much are the workers being paid, what's going on with the recipes, things like that. So we knew pretty early on that we needed to build a partnership from scratch. And this is the fun part is that this has kind of become a family business where my dad actually did part of his career in Uganda. And he kind of let some of his friends in his network know, like my daughter is doing this crazy thing where she's trying to start this company. And it just so happened that Stephen, Joel's father, and another friend of theirs, Domon, were looking to get into a new business space. They were really excited by the potential of accessing the global market. And agro-processing is something that is an area that people look for because 80% of the Ugandan economy or more is agricultural. There's just not a lot of processing happening. And so I think they got excited and Joel somehow got roped into this. Joel, I'll let you tell your side. But that's kind of how it first got started. We started having conversations and then kind of early 2019, once we started to get interest from retailers like Sprouts, we were like, okay, maybe this can be a thing. And we kind of went for it.

11:45 Joel - So yeah. Oh, yes. Thank you. She pretty much agreed with us. Well, I passed on the fact that Renee, you may have forgotten the year. We actually first met in 2018 towards the end. Then 2019 is when we did our first order. Yes. So I first connected with Renee, I think, last 2018. By the time we connected, we had talked for a while, but mainly online. Then she came down, I think, working on perfecting the recipes. So at least the team is quite confident with what we're supposed to do. The journey, I can't add much. She really just painted this passport. That's really how it went. I just remember one day my dad comes and tells me that this is a new business. It seems like it's quite interesting. I'm like, well, it's interesting. You know me, I'm interesting. That's the stuff I hoped for and never looked back. And maybe I could say that I joined in while Renee was running the Maslin itself. I've been with the company from inception, at least on our end. I've been with them about four years, which is basically the age of the company as well. But yeah, our first meeting physically was in Campala, down in Uganda. She does come here quite a lot. At least once or twice a year, if you don't count the COVID addresses.

12:54 Jessi - That's awesome. Yeah. And I guess I'm curious too, Joel, on your background. It sounds like you were intrigued by new interesting ideas. And your dad mentioned this to you. Did you have some background in a production facility with 100 plus people at a time? Or was this new? I'm curious about what it was like when you heard this idea, if you had any background.

13:31 Joel - When I had the idea, no, I didn't have a background at the time. When I had the idea, it was interesting, but I don't think I understood the scope of it at the beginning. Because when you said I grew up processing facilities, at the back of my head, I thought that maybe something small with about say five people running something. So when I got there, when I got on the ground and saw the scope of it, I was a bit overwhelmed. I wanted to lie. But then since I did not have the background in the beginning, I had to do some reading. I had to get my facts in order. But after a while, I actually started out in production, which was a good thing, I think, needed to get in touch with the product itself, understand the whole mechanics of how everything works. Then after a while, I found myself in operations because there's a small gap there. But generally, I think it's been going well.

14:24 Renee - Joel is being humble because he, I don't know what we would do without Joel, first of all. This happens so much, Jessi, in our industry, but it's people who know nothing, and just have the go-getting attitude and have a mission and just make it happen. Joel is definitely one of those people where when we first met, it was just me, him and Charlotte playing with scaling up the recipes because they had never done it before. We literally went from a lab at a university squeezing limes by hand to now he's in charge of all of our audit processes, all of our certification, meeting with local government officials, getting our shipment scheduled. It's pretty amazing. And he didn't do any of this stuff before. And I'm somewhat the same way. I had no idea how to make a product or sell products. So I think our company is a good testament to if you work hard enough and you learn things, you can figure it out. We're figuring it out. So yeah, Joel is amazing and the whole team there is amazing.

15:35 Jessi - That's so cool. I love that. So what did it look like to get the current facility set up? And I'm also curious with the timing of, so if you all were meeting 2018, 2019, and then you have the pandemic kit and Renee, you can no longer go visit. What did it look like to get the facility up and running? How did you plan for scaling up while also getting started? Yeah, I'm just super curious about what that looked like managing the production. Did you already have farm partners? Yeah, I'm curious about all of it.

16:11 Renee - Yeah. So I'll start and then Joel, you can tack on from where I end. But so I had, as I mentioned, when I first started the company, I worked with a local dried fruit manufacturer. And that's how I came up with my initial recipes, initial products to test the market. So officially, I started Amazi in 2016, 2017. And what I would do is I would sell to mom and pops. I would get feedback. I would do demos. I had a website. I mean, not much was happening there. But I started to realize that we needed anchor accounts in order to be able to scale in the way that we wanted. And so basically, we were waiting for some point of like, if we build it, they will come. If we invest in breaking ground and building a facility, there will be at least enough demand to not just produce a pallet and we ship it overseas. So we needed an anchor. And this is a total tangent. But I know that there's so much conversation around like, don't go nationwide when you're just getting started. And for us, it was a little bit of a backwards approach where we actually needed a decent sized account to do anything because we were kind of caught in this weird place where I was importing like air fright half palettes or palettes from this producer that we couldn't scale with. So anyway, long story short, we get the yes from Sprouts. At first, it was like a two month request. Like this Chris Mogul, I remember, sent this email and he was like, we want these two SKUs. Can you be ready in two months? And we hadn't really broken ground yet. Like we had a plan because we knew we were in review and we were kind of waiting. Like this is like kind of early 2019, spring 2019. We were like already working out the arrangement. We were talking about what things might look like. I think land maybe was identified, all that stuff. But we hadn't like fully gone in. And then we got the yes and I was like, oh, there's no way we could do that. So I negotiated, I requested. I was like, listen, we're in this really exciting position. We're about to scale up manufacturing, have a dedicated facility. Can you give us till the end of the year? So they were like, yep, we can do the December reset instead of the June reset. So that was kind of our like ready, set, go. And I'm pretty sure that's how it felt, Joel. We just ready, set, go. My dad flew over there first and they kind of broke ground, contracted somebody who still helps us at the facility there to improve design. Everybody just deep dived and went real hard for six months or so. And the initial launch to Sprouts, we still did in partial partnership with our previous production partners. And then we got Joel's team up and running kind of way end of 2019. In January of 2020, I flew there and watched them do their first production run. So thank God we did that. Because literally the next month, things started shutting down. So we, yeah, I think if I hadn't been there in January, and we didn't do the first run, then I think things would have gone very differently for us. But we at least had a baseline of like, this is how you produce, yes, no, like, what's good, what's bad, what do we need to fix? And then I think in some ways, it was a slight blessing with COVID, just in the sense that there was kind of a ramp up start instead of it being right away, like, these are the volumes every month. Things slowed down for a few months. As you know, retailers were kind of like, we don't know what's going on. We had just launched, so we were a new brand and people didn't really know it's not like we were already flying off the shelves. So it was super challenging to keep the business afloat. But I do think it gave us a little bit longer time to kind of get things right and kind of practice scaling up our runs over time, as opposed to being thrown in right away. I'll let Joel add to that because he was there in Uganda and I was stuck on this side. But that was my experience of the initial timeline.

20:25 Joel - Yeah, that's a good question, actually. And it's so interesting how the first time she stated, they had a totally different perspective. First, the order, we were in the middle, okay, we're towards the tail end of construction, I remember, of the actual facility. But then at the same time, this order was coming to a point where we needed fulfillers. Then the pressure was so immense on our side because now this was our first order. It's a very big plant that we have to keep, so the quality has to be up there. Ah, it was nerves all over. So the pressure from the contractor, like, get us this… I didn't know, it's so scary.

21:09 Joel - Yeah, it was. And at the same time, you're like, in production, like every section, you have your, like nothing is perfect. Like it is perfect, but at the back of your head, like, no, no, we can do better here. So yes, it was quite a bit of pressure. I think we sent that out on spot order. Was that 2020 or 2019 really?

21:25 Renee - It was at the beginning of 20… I think it was beginning of 2020. Because I think what… Yeah, it was either the way end of 2019 or the beginning of 2020. But oh, no, they did a trial run. They did a small trial run at the end of 2019. And then I went there for the full first production run. So there was a trial run at the end of 2019 and we used some of that product in our initial Sprouts launch and then fully transitioned to Joel's team after that during COVID.

21:57 Joel - Yeah, but also when you say how did we set up and how did we basically, how do we have the current facility, the first thing my mind goes, because you know, this side, this end, I've been part of the process from the beginning, like from the point where they laid the first brick. So setting up the facility, that's where my mind goes. And it was quite a process, a nine month process, if I may say, of just basically getting documents in order, making sure you're registered in all the necessary, with all the necessary authorities, ensuring that you can export because that's the process also in itself. And now do remember, this is my first time doing all of this. So I'm just basically grasping at straws and trying to figure everything out. Luckily, I managed to get by somehow. But yes, it was quite a moment. And at the end of it, at least we got good reviews from all our hard work. It was quite nice. It was quite nice. Yeah.

22:59 Renee - Yeah. Getting anything done from a formal official perspective, especially in Uganda, is very hard. Joel has worked hard from the beginning of figuring out these systems, because they are really opaque. That's very hard. So yeah, he's, we would be lost without him.

23:23 Jessi - Yeah, you mentioned like working with like local and government officials and things like that. And then, you know, if you're launching with Sprouts, I'm sure you had to submit all the food safety documentation. So you had to have the plant all registered with all the different, that's, that's a lot to navigate. That's amazing. Yeah, both sides. I think we're biting off a little more than we could chew. But we somehow made it happen. So that's amazing. Yeah. I'm curious to like, do you, without, you know, going into any, you know, your your secret sauce, like, do you, did you have to like import equipment? Like, I don't know how unique drying equipment is, or like what the drying process is like, because I know, you know, buying machinery, you know, is always a big endeavor. So like, was that a, did you have to buy a lot of, invested in a lot of equipment for the plant as well?

24:12 Renee  - Yeah, everything, I think equipment wise is more or less important. And my dad has somehow become like a fruit drying nerd, and has like, so much enjoyed researching the different drying technologies. I'm like, good, because I'm not interested at all. But no, he is the one who helped coordinate our initial machinery. We found I think these are the people in Oregon, right, Joel? Yeah, we got the harvest savers from yeah, so we use harvest saver dryers. But yeah, we imported those and they were built alongside the facility. And yeah, all the things nuts and bolts.

24:54 Jessi  - And then Joel, I assume you had to learn how all the machinery runs and make sure other people are trained how to like, you know, maintain the machinery and everything. That sounds complicated.

25:07 Joel - I received the manual before the machine arrives, like, I say two months to its arrival and I have to get everything in that manual in my head because I'm the person in charge of training everyone. So all the questions that you need to have answers to. But it was quite a journey. And I'll actually say, I'll send my thanks to the gentleman from Oregon, they really did provide some support, they always answered my questions. So yeah, that was nice. But also getting familiar with the import process, because now the export process and the import process are two completely different things, especially here. So trying to navigate all that at the same time, you're trying to figure out how the machine works, trying to figure out if it will work, given that current power needs because now the machines were actually produced for the American market. So we do necessarily have some, so you have to figure all that out. It's quite interesting. Yeah.

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28:16 Jessi - I grew up on a farm, so I'm always curious on the farming side, how close are the farms that you're sourcing from? Joel, what's it like for you connecting with farmers? Is coordinating, receiving supply in? And Renee, on your side, forecasting how much you're going to purchase from each farmer. I'm curious a little bit about that piece of getting the products to the facility and at that peak time, because you mentioned trying to get them at that peak freshness, so you can lock that in and dry it at that peak point. So you got to really thread the needle on all those pieces.
29:00 Renee - Yeah. And it's certainly not something we have down to a science yet. I think as we continue to scale, it'll become, I hope, somewhat more predictable and easier. But yeah, I'll touch on one part of it and then I'll let Joel talk through the actual logistics of sourcing and stuff. But we have a few farmers groups. I think we have a total of around 300 actively in our network. And then there are more than that in our extended network. And I'd say we have one group out far out west. We have one group that's pretty close to the facility for jackfruit and then pineapple is also fairly close. And then I think there's one group further east, but Joel can probably correct me on that one, if I'm wrong. But in terms of planning ahead, I think that's the hardest part. Our farmers and farmer relationships, Jessi, I'm sure you know this growing up on a farm, but farming is the livelihood and predictability and seasonality are super important. And so we actually don't contract farm right now, because when we first tried to set up contracts, we… So we do have contracts that represent the partnerships, I should clarify. We have contracts with the farmers, but we don't commit to every season I'm buying this much, because we found that when we first were giving projections, if farmers were over-promised, it actually very much soured relationships, which I can completely understand. I experienced this a lot with my previous suppliers, actually, with my previous drying partners. That was one of our main issues is that I felt they didn't honor the farmer relationships in the right way, where there's a lot of over-promising and a lot of under-delivering. And sometimes that's the nature of this business. It's like, yeah, we're going to grow at this rate and you grow at this rate or you think this skew is going to be popular, but this one is. And so you actually don't need that much planting. And so I think our approach and what I've tried to do as best as I can is… And certainly, the economy and stuff has thrown wrenches in this, but I try to project out this is how many runs we'll have in the next six months, the next year. And then I work with Joel and Charlotte around seasonality. And sometimes we shift it forward or backwards depending. And we meet in person with the farmers. I don't know how often they do, but we do have liaisons on the ground. And then I also try to meet with at least one group when I'm there just to express, hey, this might not be going at the cadence that you want all the time. We can't make all the promises in the world, but we're at least showing up on our word when we give it and building from there some level of trust. So that's been how I see the partnerships. And I think, Joel, I'll let you touch a little bit more on how you go about picking up at what time with ripeness and logistics and that kind of thing.

32:04 Joel - Yeah. I'll first touch on something you said. It's very hard to predict when you'll get the fruit of times because recently, we find that the seasons change depending on when it rains. That's the simplest way to predict the seasons change. And the kind of farmers that we deal with, remember, let me explain that a bit. We buy our fruit from smallholder farmers. Smallholder farmers are basically families that basically produce some fruit for sale and some to keep for themselves. And then we have what we call our field workers. And these field workers basically go to the areas that are prevalent for the specific fruit that we're looking for. And then they set up, first of all, they identify the farmers we want to work with. And then they set them up in what we call farmer groups. They give these groups a structure. They have their own leadership. And so, of course, they work for themselves. And then at the point where we eat fruit from them, the production manager usually, depending on the purchase quota that we have, will reach out to the field workers. And then the field workers, depending on the, again, as I said, the seasons are not very clear, depending on who has what. Because remember, again, these are very smallholder farmers. Probably the biggest piece of land they have is about two acres. And those two acres are divided between different crops. So by the time you see what they have or what you want, certainly maybe under half a acre. So basically, the field officer gets the fruits. Depending on the area, they all have collection centers. The fruit is collected at the collection center where it's weighed. When it's weighed, it's then transported in the truck and transported to the factory. At the factory, it's weighed again. Then depending on the ripeness level, it can either go to the ripening facility if it still needs to ripen or maybe if it's ripe and not yet ready to be produced because of the current production schedule. It will then go to the cold room where it's stored for a bit as it waits. But yes, that's also a thing. We try to, because of our model, which is quite unique and quite hectic, we try to be very nice to our farmers. The fact that we are able to reach out to them directly allows us to compensate them above the market rates that they would get if we were doing the mid-term. So you find that in the long term, again, this is a good thing for us because usually when they see the kind of movement that's happening and the kind of money that's coming from the kind of fruit we're getting from them, again, they try to increase the size of their farms. This is a good thing for us. Of course, it may be a bad thing if, for example, like what we just said earlier, the certain projections that we think are going to come don't come. So at that point, we try to be as open as we can with them, just so that they can be the right headspace when the projections that we expect don't come, maybe. But yes, that's basically how we source our fruits down here.

35:06 Renee - Yeah. I mean, hearing you explain it, I was there to help set up the first groups and have seen it happen. But when you listen to it, it's crazy. It's like, we are really working with… It is crazy. These farmers in very remote areas have collected to get product on the shelf at Sprout. I mean, that's crazy. And I mean, I certainly won't take credit for figuring out the paperwork because I know Joel did all that. But I mean, it's pretty amazing that we're able to bring things from like seven-hour drive from Kampala to the shelf at Sprout. I think that's really awesome. Just hearing you say that, Joel, reminded me that it's pretty cool.

35:50 Joel - Yeah. Also, where the farms are located, the different fruits are prevalent in different areas of the country because the different fruits grow in different conditions around the country. So we have some coming from the central, some coming from the east, as I said, far east, some coming from the far west. The ones that are not in central, you're looking at between seven to eight hour drives to pick up the fruits. So yeah, I think that's a picture of where the farmers are located.

36:20 Jessi -  Yeah, that's amazing. And very cool that you're able to compensate them above other market rates that they might be able to receive. That's really neat. So from like receiving fruit in and drying it to… Then it's got to cross the ocean and get to the US. And then I'm assuming… Do you have a fulfillment center in the US that receives it? And then it goes to a retailer like Sprouts? I'm curious, once the product's made, what happens to get it here and for us to see it on retail shelves?

36:53 Renee - Yeah. So we package everything in Uganda right now, which is great. That's part of our mission. It's to bring as much value addition back to the source. So I import by more or less the container at a time. And I hold everything in a third party fulfillment center. We just moved fulfillment centers like last week. Oh wow. So our new one… Yeah. Our new one is in the Atlanta area. We just got our first container there last week and everything went smoothly so far. So that's great. And from there, we distribute. So if we have KeHE orders, they come and pick up for Sprout. We'll do direct with any retailer that will let us but otherwise we go through distributors. Yeah. Everything goes out of one fulfillment center. We try our best to keep it consolidated.

37:50 Jessi -  And how big is a container for those that aren't as familiar with shipping by the container? Like how many pallets? What's the equivalent?

38:00 Joel - A container is about 40 feet. To fill it up, we take about 19 pallets. That's 100 by 110 centimeter pallets. Yes. Maybe from the other shipment part of my end again, I do handle the shipments and logistics. I handle everything from here up to the portal choice. In this case, we just do the portal Atlanta. All the documentation, I let it go at the point when the Amazon agent takes over. But yes, also the containers we use, we use a reefer. We don't use the conventional container. Reason being we want to keep our product at room temperature at all times as this only as the effects of the shelf life of the product. So in order to achieve that, we have to use reefers into the refrigerated containers. Yeah.

38:42 Jessi - Okay. Yeah. So how long does it take to go across the ocean usually? And then I assume that, well, and I know there was port issues during the pandemic, but like to get checked in and make it to the distribution center, how long does that take?

38:57 Joel -  Yeah. My end, especially with shipping, I just need to head back to three weeks. The two to three weeks is mainly because of the reefer. And usually since our reefers are dependent on imports coming in, those imports have to be of reefers as well. So usually when those imports are slow, it's pretty hard to get your hands on the reefer down. But if the reefer was in question, it would take me about two to three days to have that all put together. And so it is, was there a second part to discuss? About how long it takes from the port to? Yes. Initially it was going for 48 days, but now I think it's down to 35 days on the water, which is just about a month really. Yes. And that's, that's usually the time. The time usually, okay, the time usually depends on where it's going. So Atlanta is now at about 35 days.

39:56 Renee - Yes. Yeah. I feel like when we're placing orders, we aim to have it shipped a month and a half to two months, usually a month and a half before we want it landed because then it'll land and then it takes a few days to clear. And then we have to do all the receiving and then, you know, so, and every once in a while they do a fun FDA hold. Usually they're very quick. We had one on the last shipment, but one time there was a long FDA hold, which was frustrating, but usually it's quick. And then in terms of, you know, barring any port congestion there, it's just a couple of days to clear. And then, you know, usually within a day from it being picked up, it arrives at our facility and, and, and yeah, so that's kind of this side of things is the longer we wait, the longer it takes, the more we have to pay. So we, we try to clear it as soon as possible. And, you know, again, barring any holds or anything like that. But yeah, then the receiving process is the longest part.

40:56 Jessi - Yeah. And then I didn't have this on my list. So let me know if this is, this is not a good question to ask, but I'm curious to support, like to support the volumes and keeping the facility at so many employees and everything, and, and your shipping volumes and containers, like, do you also do like, like, are you a raw ingredient provider for some companies? Do you do private label work? Like, you know, how else do you support the volume? Is that okay to ask?

41:22 Renee - You're totally okay to ask, because that's exactly where we've been working the past several months. Private label contracts take so long. We have a couple underway, and they're all heading in the right direction. But they are taking a while. So we've developed a few new products for private label that have been approved. And we're working on those. We do have a few ingredient customers, but we are working on additional ones. And right now, we're talking to a bunch of chocolate companies about incorporating some of our dried fruit products. Joel has actually started recently attending more trade shows, actually on the Uganda side, and getting interest from other markets, such as South Africa, and Europe, because it's actually closer to Uganda. So it's easier to shift to. But yeah, I mean, a large part of the past year or so has been focusing on these other channels, because, I think getting started, we had our eyes set on retail, but with COVID hitting right away, and being an emerging brand, it's been definitely an uphill climb to get volumes high and consistent all the time. So we've definitely had our fair share of ups and downs over the past year or so. And there have definitely been times where we had to… There was at least a month or so last year, I think, when the facility was full on closed, because we just couldn't afford. I couldn't afford to produce for no reason. And they couldn't afford to pay wages for no reason, although actually, I think they did. I think they did support their core employees anyway. So it's been… We're all learning as we go. But I mean, that's a great question. And that's exactly where our heads are at. So we're really trying now to expand. So if anybody listening to this podcast is interested in any tropical fruit, we actually work in a number of fruit verticals beyond our existing skews. So just reach out to… I mean, I'm sure you'll put our contact with the end, but reach out to us because we've been actively seeking and we're really excited about our new private label clients. But those contracts probably won't hit with their first orders until end of this year early next. So they just take time, but they're happening slowly but surely.

43:49 Jessi - Oh, that's awesome. Yeah, we'll definitely share your contact info and everything at the end. I also wanted to ask each of you to end on just what you're excited about next. Both from a brand and just from a personal side of what parts of the business excite you the most and you're excited to continue to work on in the future, or it could be parts that are already your favorite, but just kind of curious, like, what are you excited about right now?

44:14 Joel -  I'm very excited for the new flavors. We've been working so hard to come up with some new variations to the current fruits we have, and we're increasing our portfolio to include very many other fruits that I feel many people love. I'm very excited about that. I'm mostly very excited about the potential that the business has. I'm sure that the direction we're going is difficult at times, very tough, but we're facing the right direction and I'm happy.

44:46 Renee - I’m also excited about the potential. I think I forget it sometimes. I don't know, Joel, if you ever feel that when you're in the thick of it, but I sometimes forget that there's potential out there when we're just back here trying to figure it out. But no, I mean, I'm excited about our brand refresh. I think it's the right direction for retail. And I personally am really excited about the potential that our business has in exactly the spaces that you mentioned. I think that there's such a need right now for high integrity supply chains, for quality products that is making a positive impact. And the dried fruit space right now is so commoditized. And I think we have a really unique offering that significant retailers are interested in now. We have meetings about private label with Wegmans and Thrive and Misfits and Sprouts. They're talking to us about it. They're interested. They're asking questions, even Kroger. So I think, who knows if we'll land all these contracts. But my point is the fact that people are, I think, looking for some quality and a story to tell with their products, I think, more than ever before. And I think it's certainly been a slog and it's been a bumpy road. But it feels like we're well positioned to serve, I think, a growing need. We've done the legwork of building the supply chain. We have the transparency. We have the quality. We have some good innovation in the pipeline, too. And so I think that whether it's a store or again, our existing ingredient partners are companies that make a product that shares the values. And they want to be able to tell their customers that every single ingredient has been sourced with integrity. And I think we're seeing more and more of that, like I said. So whether we partner with ShareSnacks, they're a trail mix company. Everything they do is like single origin, single sourced, compostable packaging. And we're seeing the same thing with some chocolate companies touting how they make their chocolate. So I think it's going to be the next step in a lot of these products where no longer does a chocolate company saying all those things want to buy their pineapple from Dole. They want to get pineapple from the farmer or from a company that is supporting those farmers. So I guess that was long-winded. But I do think that there's a lot of potential in this space. And I love building. I actually love building those partnerships. I love my calls with bulk and private label clients because it's really… I like all… Actually, I like all side of sales and business development. But I really like the relationship building and just… It feels like we've built something useful, which is nice to know. So yeah, so I think I'm excited about that part for sure.

47:45 Jessi - Yeah, I love that. Consumers are more educated than ever and looking for transparency. And like you said, the dried fruit has just… It really has been such a commodity up until now. And I mean, really trying the Amazi products, it really, for me, was this moment of, oh, this is so much better than any dried fruit I've had before. I kind of did… I viewed them as a commodity in my mind because it's in the bulk pack of the grocery store or they kind of all taste the same and they all kind of tasted… I didn't have… Whatever I buy, I kind of just have mediocre expectations. But once I tried the Amazi products, I was like, this tastes so much better. Consumers can have access to a dried fruit that tastes so amazing. It made me really excited and just seeing the transparency. I love seeing what you're doing and getting to hear today more about the hard work that you are both putting in and your teams are putting in is just… It's really exciting.

48:39 Renee - Thanks so much, Jessi. That means a lot. I know that you've gotten a team work so hard after all of our feedback and iterations. And yeah, I think also just understanding the American palette. That was the first step. It was like, what do you guys want? So I think… Yeah, I'm so glad that you can taste the difference. I know that's been years of work.

49:02 Jessi - For those listening, I definitely encourage you to go check out the Amazi website. So it's amazifoods.com. And I'll put that in the show notes as well. On Instagram, you can follow at Amazi Foods. Is there any other links or places that people should go to that I should include in the notes?

49:24 Renee - We do have Amazon listings as well. If you search for us, Amazi Foods Jackfruit or something like that, it will come up. But yeah, those are definitely the main ones. And we would love your support on retail shelves as well. That would mean a lot to us.

49:41 Jessi - Awesome. Amazing. Well, thank you both so much. This was so awesome. Thank you, Joel, for staying up late to join the conversation. I really appreciate that. But yeah, this has just been awesome. And I know that our community members are going to really value hearing your experience and just appreciate you both. And we'll all be continuing to cheer for Amazi. And I'm probably going to go eat some more dried pineapple right now if I can find more in my house.
50:02 Renee - Thank you so much for having us, Jessi. And Joel, thank you for joining me. It was much more fun to do the podcast with you than by myself.

50:12 Joel - Yes, thank you for having me as well. It was a warm welcome. My first podcast. I hope I did well.

50:22 Jessi - You did. You're a pro. I think it'll be the first of many. Thank you for listening in today. I'm so honored you joined me for this conversation. And I love hearing from you all with feedback, suggestions, or if you just want to say hi at podcast at startupcpg.com, or you can find me on LinkedIn. If you liked this episode, we'd love for you to share it with a friend or colleague, subscribe so you don't miss future episodes, and maybe even leave us a five star review on Apple podcasts. If you aren't yet in our Slack community of founders and experts, we'd love to see you there. You can get the free invite at startup cpg.com and find all our other awesome resources there like webinars, databases, the blog, the magazine, and virtual and in-person events. And if you found yourself rocking out to our intro and outro music, which I do every single time, make sure to check out the super fantastic on Spotify. It's the band of our startup cpg founder, Daniel Scharff. I'm Jessi Freitag, your host and producer. And on behalf of the whole team at Startup CPG, thank you for being here and see you next week.