The Startup CPG Podcast

04:25 Jessi - Hi GT, welcome to the show today. How are you today?
04:30 GT - I’m doing very well. Thank you. Thanks for having me on.
04:33 Jessi - Yeah, absolutely. It is my pleasure. I'm so happy to have you here. It's a huge honor for me to get to chat with you. And you know, I've been a fan of, you know, the Synergy Kombucha's and really all your additional product lines as well over the years. I think, you know, I tried first tried kombucha maybe what it must have been around 2015, a little later than the game than I wish I was here in Portland. And I tried it and I was like, this is really intriguing. Kind of was trying all the brands. And then I tried one of the synergy flavors and I was like, well, this like this is perfect. Like whoever made this, like this is what I want to drink more of. And then that's when I really I started, you know, Googling who made this. And then I found I found you read a little bit about the story and then was like, oh, this is the person who's responsible for bottling my favorite drink and creating, you know, my basically one of my favorite industries. And so, you know, Lavender Love is my personal favorite flavor, I think of all time. Golden Pineapple is a close second. But yeah, it just it's it's so fun because I am I love kombucha. I drink a lot of it. Not nearly as much as you. I believe with all the taste testing that you do and everything. Yeah, I'm just I love the industry that you've built and just I'm so grateful for the work that you put in for all of us to be able to enjoy, you know, a product that didn't used to exist on the market.
05:57 GT - Well, thank you for saying that. I mean, we do pour our hearts and souls into every bottle and batch we make. And as I'm sure you know about kombucha, it's not something that's easy to make because you really grow it more than you make it. And it's very sensitive to how it's made and who's making it and the energy around it. So we do really see it as a labor of love.
06:15 Jessi - Yeah, I love that. I at one point, I was like, maybe I'll try to make kombucha. I think I bought the original, you know, your original flavor. And I was like, I'm going to grow my own scoby. And I did grow a scoby, but it did not. I never got it to taste great. And I was like, you know what? I'm going to keep supporting the company that I know makes it taste awesome and keep supporting them existing in the world and making great kombucha. I'm not going to I'm not going to, you know, work on farming it on my own. So that little attempt made me realize, oh, my gosh, this is such a process. And I think you've kind of referred to it as like more similar to farming than, you know, it's not like if somebody says, hey, we need more kombucha. You can't just magically make it happen. You know, it's got to it's got to ferment. It's got to grow.
07:01 GT - That's exactly right. I mean, we see our kombucha more as a form of agriculture than we do like a soda or a tea where you're just basically mixing water with flavor and sweetness or something like that. And that's actually how I fell in love with kombucha is when, you know, my parents were making it in the early 90s and they were making it and drinking it religiously. And, you know, just watching it being made, you you almost immediately appreciate some of the ceremonial aspects of making kombucha where, you know, you really are like growing a plant participating in the magic that I think Mother Nature creates whenever she creates something. And so kombucha is no exception. So that's something that I felt almost tasked with to make it my personal mission to not only share kombucha with the world, but also to protect it.
07:48 Jessi - Yeah, I love that. And it's amazing that your parents were I believe they're essentially gifted a scoby from that someone brought back from like the Himalayas. And then here we are 25 plus 27 years later, you're making millions of bottles a day, but still in the small like five gallon batches. It's just it's so incredible. And I'm wondering if you can kind of talk us a little bit about like what what it looks like today, like, you know, to to exist as a company like, you know, how big is your manufacturing? Like how big is the team now? I believe you have hundreds of people like, you know, just what's the kind of lay of the land for you? And what's the day? What's the day in the life like for you?
08:28 GT - Well, it's funny. I mean, what hasn't changed is the way we make kombucha. I mean, the way I made it for my parents kitchen when I first started my company in 1995 is, believe it or not, the exact same way that we make it today. So to kind of paint a picture for you in the audience, I mean, we start off with organic green and black tea. And then for those that don't know a lot about kombucha, actually, because it's a living thing, it requires a source of energy or food for it to consume and therefore to kind of allow it to grow and reproduce. So in kombucha, it's basically a form of carbon. That's a carbohydrate that you can use. It could be organic cane sugar. It can be honey. It can be agave. It can be fruit juice. So at GTs, we use kiwi juice because it creates a nice kind of tangy flavor note for the finished product. So we blend the tea with the kiwi juice and then we take what's called a SCOBY, which is an acronym for a symbiotic culture of bacteria and yeast. And it looks a lot like a pancake because it's circular in shape and somewhat rubbery in texture. And you place that in what we do is it's a five gallon vessel. So that's why we say our batches are small enough to hug because, you know, even like a teenager can lift it up and we place the SCOBY in this vessel, cover it and allow it to kind of naturally ferment in a warm, peaceful kind of almost like nursery type vibe environment where it's fermented for 30 days. And then after the fermentation, the kiwi juice has been mostly consumed by the culture, the caffeine and tannins in the tea has been virtually removed because all these things are nutrients for the culture to grow. And what it does in return is it consumes these and then replaces them with organic acids, enzymes, probiotics and other nutrients that we can benefit from that improve our health. And so when the tea is finished with its fermentation, it's no longer sweet. It's now tangy and tart. It has this natural effervescence and it's also rich with all the nutrients that I just shared. And in addition to that, the culture itself also reproduces. So at the end of the 30 days, not only do you have what's now called kombucha, which is the liquid, but you also have two cultures that you can now use to make two batches. And that's what is part of the beauty of kombucha. It's very regenerative, very sustainable and again, very similar to what Mother Nature does is she constantly reproduces herself. And so at GT is just to again, paint the picture of how we make our kombucha because we limit ourselves to the five gallon vessel size, unlike the 50 to 100000 gallons that a lot of our competitors sometimes use for efficiency sake. At any given point, we can have hundreds of thousands of these five gallon vessels going on in our facility. You know, again, we call the fermentation room where we make the kombucha kind of like a nursery because that's really where similar to a baby that's just been born. That's really kind of their first taste of the world. And so we hold it in very high regard and treat it very sacredly.
11:34 Jessi - Yeah, wow. That's yeah, that's amazing. I think you you have like over like a half million square feet of like facility space, is that right?
11:43 GT - Yes, that's exactly right. And the reason why that is, is that again, like using the analogy of a farmer, you know, compared to that of call it a soda pop maker, you know, the Coke’s and the Pepsi’s of the world, if they want to make more of their products, they just kind of essentially open up the spigot more, blend more water and flavor and carbonation. And that's how they make their products. And all you really need is basically faster equipment with kombucha. You know, yes, it's nice to have fast bottling equipment, but that's not really what makes kombucha kombucha. It's the fermentation. And therefore, just like a farmer tending to his or her crops, the more you want to grow, the more land you need. And so that's why over the course of the last almost three decades that we've been around, we've kind of took over about a half a million square feet of production space to allow us to make the kombucha that we make to that supplies basically all of North America.
012:38 Jessi - Yeah. Wow. Yeah. And I grew up on a farm and as many of our regular listeners may know, and so I love the, you know, I can really relate to the farming piece. And, you know, with doing your own manufacturing and then you've got, you know, marketing teams, sales teams for you. Like, you know, what is your, you know, a day or maybe even a week? I'm sure every day can kind of be different. You know, are you out on the floor? Are you meeting with, you know, marketing teams, you know, helping lead different teams? Like, what does it look like now for you? You know, yeah, kind of day in the life.
13:13 GT - Yeah. Well, I think the best way to answer it is I'm involved in all of the above. And, you know, I think there's not to oversimplify it, but I will for a second. There really is two types of entrepreneurs. There's entrepreneurs that for whatever reason just tend to want to be involved in maybe like sales, marketing and finance, right? So they want to make sure that their business is doing financially well, want to make sure that sales are growing and that marketing is kind of slick, cool, and keeping the brand relevant, all of which is very important. But at times that means that they're really not participating in product development, innovation, production, some of the supply chain, some of the not as sexy aspects of the business, but certainly much, you know, very critical. For me, I'm the second type of entrepreneur, which is involved in everything. And I think honestly, the reason why that is for me and for people like me is that, you know, I started my company from scratch, essentially. I didn't have any investors, didn't have a partner. I was just really a young lad because I was about 15 years old. But I just wanted to do something with my life. And I was really inspired by how special kombucha was. And, you know, as I mentioned, my parents were making it and drinking it. And it ended up actually helping my mom with her breast cancer. So it was her story that kind of motivated me to do something. And therefore, I honestly wasn't like monetarily driven or even success driven. I just wanted to do something that I believed in. And I think when an entrepreneur starts with that kind of foundation, and always there's always exceptions. But generally speaking, you're you feel it's almost like a parent raising their child. You feel just kind of almost obligated and committed to be being involved in this in every aspect of the life that you're trying to that you've given birth to, so to speak. And so that's why with my company, and this is now answering your question specifically, is I'm involved in everything. So it varies from day to day. But, you know, it involves certainly taste testing product. I believe that quality is king. And that's the most important thing, no matter what. More important in marketing, more important than sales or finance. You got to make sure that what you're creating is the best that it can be and that you're staying true to why you got started, because it's very easy to lose sight of that. So I'm involved in the production, taste testing. I love innovation and R&D. So all the products we make from the different product families, I'm the guy behind them. And that's something I really enjoy. I'm also involved in marketing, a little bit in sales. Sales to me is a little transactional because it's more about selling. I like more of like a visceral connection with things, whether it's my products, my employees, or ultimately the individuals that we are conducting business with. And then I do believe that finance is important. So I'm involved heavily in kind of the day-to-day financial aspects of the business, because that's actually where a lot of companies can get their, or a lot of entrepreneurs can get caught with their pants down, and they have other people handling their finances and they wake up one day and they're like, oh my God, we're out of money, or we need to raise money. And then that's where you get pulled in potentially into that trap of having to raise capital and selling your equity and bringing on an investor. And not to say that it's always bad, but that can really complicate things. So I've been fortunate enough to have to avoid that.
16:42 Jessi - Yeah. Yeah. There's multiple things I want to dig into there. And I also want to note for people, when you say that you taste every batch, that is like more than a gallon of kombucha a day though, right? Like we're talking a lot of kombucha.
16:55 GT - Yeah, it's quite a bit. And I clocked it somewhere between a gallon and a half to two gallons a day. And it's funny because I am essentially the living guinea pig to answer the question of like, can you drink too much kombucha? I think my experience is case in point that you can't really, even though I by no means encourage people to drink as much as I do, but it comes with the job.
17:15 Jessi - Yeah, I love that. And yeah, I think your perspective on growing your brand is so fascinating too. And that was one of the things I was excited about having on the show because I think that there's a lot of different ways people are growing food and beverages. Now, I think I've heard you say like different strokes for different folks, which I really like the phrase. But I think the perspective you've taken, you've taken like a really long term view, like you're in the details. You want to grow this out. You've had multiple offers for acquisitions. And I'm wondering if you can kind of talk a little bit about that, about your mindset of, you know, you're the sole owner of the company. You've stayed with it. You turned down those acquisitions. And because I think it's helpful for folks to kind of hear different strategies. I know some brands, you know, you know, they get acquired or they're focused on acquisition or they get into the business for different reasons. And I think your perspective I've always found really fascinating and refreshing. And so I'm kind of curious on that kind of long term view. You've taken almost three decades in. If you can share a little bit more about that.
18:20 GT - Yeah, absolutely. And I'm happy to. So again, I mean, I don't want to belabor the analogy, but the way I see my business and our brands and the things that we're doing is in many ways like a parent raising a child. Right. I don't think any parent truly gives birth to a child thinking like, oh, I can't wait to marry them off and send them away. So I'll never see them again. Right. Because then you could ask yourself, what's the point of having a child? So for me, starting a business, which at the time, as I mentioned earlier, didn't feel like I was truly starting a business. I felt that I was just following a passion and creating something that I believed in and protecting something that I felt needed to be protected because I felt it could bring a lot of good to the world. So that was always my North Star and continues to be. And the reason and that kind of informs why I'm in this for the long run, because, you know, first of all, I feel very blessed to do something that I love that provides a livelihood for me and my family as well as other families. It's something that I'm passionate for and something that, again, I just personally enjoy. And so, you know, it's hard to say that, especially after 28 years. So in my mind, why would I why would I throw this away? Why would I sell it to run it, roll the dice of like, OK, what are the chances of me finding something like this again? Because it's not lost on me. I mean, I interact with a lot of people, my friends, you know, I try to stay grounded. And what I've learned is that people actually can spend their entire life trying to find that one thing that they're passionate about that they can get behind. And so I feel like I found it. So so again, why would I turn my back on it? The other thing is, you know, unfortunately, there's always exceptions. But whenever I have personally witnessed an incredible brand that's been sold off to a bigger company, I would say nine out of ten times it it doesn't get better. And it usually gets worse because what happens is and I don't even think it's intentional at times. It's just more somewhat consequential or just it's just part of the process is when something big consumes something small, they do that because, you know, big brands can't behave small. But once you acquire a small brand, it's it's almost inevitable sooner or later, the culture and kind of behavior of the big brand thinking is going to somewhat contaminate the small brand thinking. And the next thing you know, that small brand has lost its identity. It's lost its purpose. It's lost kind of its sexiness because what makes small brands sexy is they can do things that big brands can't do. They can take chances. They can take risks. They can color outside the lines. And once you get absorbed by a big brand, all of that goes away. And then the heart and soul is gone. And so I think to click in summary, because everything that I make is a personal passion of mine and it bears my name, I just wouldn't feel comfortable selling it off for no matter how much amount of money that I'd be offered in exchange for the risk of the big brand. I think that's the root of the quality and integrity to go down. You know, for me to be regretful of the fact that like essentially my child I abandoned. And so that's why I'm here and I'm here to stay and I feel very blessed to be able to do what I do. And that's why I have no plans on selling or no plans and kind of stopping what I'm doing.
21:47 Jessi - Yeah, I really appreciate you sharing that. That's really helpful and just inspiring. And I am curious because also I don't believe you've ever raised any outside investment money. And, you know, has it over the time you've been growing this, like I assume as like a 15, 16 year old, most 15, 16 year olds aren't thinking about, you know, CPG grocery store margins kind of thing. Like, you know, what does it kind of look like for you to build a business that could support, you know, long term? You see a lot of brands kind of go in like not profitable, like raise money kind of to like help, you know, with that eye on acquisition. And so you've had to build a profitable business because you're not you're not waiting for that, you know, exit or anything. And so can you share a little bit about what that's looked like? Have you had to figure out along the way, like, you know, especially when you were younger of like, oh, like, this is what it looks like to actually make money doing this and make sure that the business keeps existing?
22:44 GT - Oh, yeah, absolutely. I mean, especially in the early stages of your company's life, you have to be obsessive about making sure that you're being financially responsible. And that's difficult, I think, for a lot of brands because they they want to grow their sales, they want to grow their distribution. They even sometimes want to expand their lines and do, you know, flavor extensions and things of that nature, all of which require money. And you can sometimes get caught up in that and then forget that making money is important. So when ever since I started, you know, I was fortunate that I was basically a one man show, so I didn't really have an overhead and I was making my kombucha from my parents kitchen for the first two years of my company's life. So what that meant is not only did I not have a labor overhead, but I didn't even have a rent overhead. And every single literal penny that I made would go back into the business. I didn't pay myself, you know, fortunately, I'm staying at home, so I kind of didn't need to. And I just kind of squirreled away all the profit from the company. So when it was time to move out, get a commercial facility, start hiring, I had that savings to get behind it. And then from that point forward, I was just always about and it was somewhat in the back of my consciousness. I mean, it certainly was intentional where I was very sensitive to not grow too fast. And there was two reasons there. I didn't want to grow too fast because they didn't want to lose quality because that's where a lot of brands mess up is they want to take over the world overnight. And then they realize that you can't preserve the integrity of your products if you grow that quickly. In addition to that, I think I was somewhat like an overprotective parent, as I've said before in the past, where I just wanted to keep my products special and close to me. So I didn't want them to be nationwide. I mean, for the first three years, it was basically only sold in like California. And so the point of all this is that I think when you're very cautiously optimistic and very conservative and very sensitive with where you go and how you get there, you preserve your profitability and you start to almost like establish a certain behavior of, again, of being financially conservative that you don't have to worry about, am I profitable or am I losing money and things of that nature? And that's why even today, we don't have the advertising budgets that a lot of our competing brands in the kombucha space as well as in the adjacent functional beverage space have and use. Because a lot of those brands aren't profitable and a lot of those brands are just positioned to sell, which is fine. But for us, we want to grow our business responsibly and therefore we kind of take the path less traveled, which is kind of as we use the phrase like slow is steady and steady is fast or something like that. Where it's like, if you just do it kind of steady, Eddie, you'll get there. May take a little bit more time, but when you get there, it'll be so much more of a richer experience than if you just raced to that destination, if that makes sense.
25:48 Jessi - Right. Yeah, no, that totally makes sense. Because yeah, I think it was, you know, you mentioned like you got into Whole Foods like, you know, four years or so in and then like Nat National was like that was 2005 ish right about that was like 10 years in when when you took everything national.
26:05 GT - Right. And that was interesting because you know what I had to do to to almost essentially resist the growth to be nationwide sooner than 10 years since I started is I had to say no to a lot of opportunities, which was hard for me and not and even ultimately hard for the other party that was being somewhat denied. Because you know, brands when you're riding that wave, you almost feel like if I don't say yes now, maybe this opportunity won't come to me. And I certainly had those moments where I had to tell like a major nationwide chain, like I'm not ready to sell to you right now. So that was some real those are really tough decisions. But luckily, I think the universe was on my side because when I was ready, they were they were still ready and things worked and and so I didn't make some of the big mistakes I sometimes think that think that you can make if you move too fast too soon. But it definitely required a lot of self control.
26:58 Jessi - Yeah, yeah, wow. And, you know, you mentioned being a one man show for a long time, like I think like, you know, those those first 10 years and then now you have a team, you have hundreds of people that you work with and I'm wondering with for you, like what it has looked like to kind of level up as a leader like when you work on your own for 10 years to then go to having a lot of employees like I assume there's some learning curve in there of you know, working with lots of other people. And, you know, just manage, you know, when you go from five to 1010 to, you know, 5050 to 100 like all those stages that that seems like a lot to manage and I'm curious for you what that process has been like has it required some, you know, introspection or like some conscious like all right, these are the things I want to focus on as a leader like what has that process been like for you.
27:47 GT - It's an interesting process. I mean, again, I say this somewhat jokingly, but there is some seriousness seriousness in the statement is hiring employees is a lot like dating to get married. And, and the reason why I say that is there are there versions of intimate relationships, like we all know that at times we can spend more time with the people we work with than the people we, you know, are married to or, or even are related to. Family and what have you. So, you know, therefore, and you always have that disadvantage where unlike real life like you can go on a series of dates and have a series of interactions before you get married in the employment space, maybe have like a handful of interactions and then you're basically going to get married. And so, you know, what I've always tried to do is make sure first and foremost that there's just alignment, there's alignment philosophically, there's alignment, even spiritually, and then there's an alignment and just in the work ethic. And, you know, I'm not going to, I'm not going to deny that at my company, I think one of the secrets of our success, or at least one of the reasons why we're successful is we're ambitious, right? Like the way I describe my personality is I'm intense. I'm a perfectionist and I'm incredibly ambitious. And so that is that translates into very fast pace and like no room for error and perfection of the standard. And so that does require a certain type of individual. So when I first started building out my team, you know, I don't think initially I was aware of how specific I had to be. So there were a couple of mistakes. And I even want to necessarily call them mistakes because I definitely learned from them. But let's just say there was certain situations where they didn't unfold the way I wanted to because I didn't maybe scrutinize that philosophical and spiritual and professional alignment as I, to the degree that I needed to. So I learned that very quickly. And that's why silly things like learning people's astrological charts, learning like people's kind of greater beliefs and passions is really important because it does become part of their DNA of who they are, who they will become as an employee. And so, you know, that's why there's a lot of energy and a lot of attention that's put into identifying who it is that we need to work with and what they need to have from a personality standpoint to be successful. And it's a journey and it's an ongoing journey.
30:10 Jessi - Yeah, I appreciate your introspection around, you know, your leadership style. And I think I heard once you say that, you know, you'll if you haven't been able to work out in the morning that you've canceled a meeting before, you don't want to deal with me after I haven't worked out in the morning. Yeah, that's exactly right. I think, again, because we're humans, we're not machines. And I need to make sure like for me, eight hours or more sleep and a nice good workout is the fuel that I need to be at my best. And if I don't get that, then I won't be at my best. And I recognize that. So I modify my schedule accordingly. Yeah, I love that. And, and to your note on just like, you know, kind of finding people with the right energy, I think, I think you had an employee who kind of, you know, started in, in maybe manufacturing, and then essentially just like really was the right fit culturally and has worked all the way up to like executive level and then helps, you know, helps find the right, you know, decide who's going to be a fit for the culture. Like, you know, can you share a little bit about that? Or, you know, other employees who have just kind of like, you know, they've been a fit and how that helps kind of maintain the culture because you know, at this point, it's not it can't all be on you. Like, you know, I assume that you got everybody that kind of fits and then everyone's kind of helping find the right fit and maintaining the culture that you know, the right culture.
31:32 GT - No, that's exactly right. I mean, because what I didn't mention, but I think you in the audience may already know this, but I dropped out of high school before I started my company. And the reason why that's important. And I'm not saying like this is the right way of doing things. This is just how I do things. Is that I guess because I don't have, you know, a really impressive academic background. I therefore don't put a whole lot of weight on someone's academic background. I think it's important. Don't get me wrong. But I think there are some companies that like they only hire MBAs. And, you know, I think that's interesting and certainly can work. And depending on the relationship as well and depending on that brand, if that brand's like hyper technical hyper transactional, like MBAs are great. But I think for something like what we do at GT is where it's a lot more heartfelt, again, this homegrown farmer vibe. And that kind of philosophy and ethos is threaded throughout everything we do from finance to operations to marketing and so forth. You know, I tend to like to find individuals that yeah, it'd be great. You have a solid background, whether that's academic or whether that's just your, your, your career and past lives at other companies. But what you can't teach is attitude. You have to be able to do that. And so that's why I probably over index or overemphasize attitude, over even academics. And because that means that if you have an attitude and a perspective that's aligned with mine and the businesses, then that is something that you can't fake and you can't teach everything else you can teach skills you can certain skills you can teach. And so that's why like in our in the hiring process and the relationships that I've, I've created with my students, I've been able to teach them. And so that's why I've cultivated with my employees. It's always just making sure first and foremost, that we, we are of a like mind.
33:20 Jessi - Yeah, yeah, no, I, I really, I really like that. And I also just, I've, I've found that, you know, true and has worked well in my own experience to some of the best people that I've hired have, you know, like, I've just I've seen their work, I've interacted with them. And I'm like, this is a person that I want to hire. And then, you know, they're like, why don't you know, I don't have the, the educational background for that job where I'm like, Well, yeah, but you got the right attitude, like, we'll figure it out. Like, let's, let's make it happen. Like, I can tell you, that you're, you're the person that's the right fit. And I want to work with you as a as a fellow human. And, you know, we'll figure out all the rest is just all details versus what you know, what fancy certificates or, you know, or education you have. So I really love that you brought that up.
34:01 GT - Yeah, you're right. I mean, again, perspective is informed so much. And so it's always important to understand people's perspectives. Yeah. And I'm also you know, since we talked a little bit about, you know, like you're, you know, you're trying to get eight hours of sleep and you know, working out and, you know, I feel like there's a lot of pressure when you're growing a company to kind of cut corners on taking care of yourself, especially for founders. It's a big topic in our community of founders trying to find balance trying to get sleep. And those kinds of things. And it seems like you've been working with a lot of people, you know, you've always really prioritized that. And also, you've had some like, interesting schedules that you've set up like that work for you. Like, I think when you started your parents, like you were working like, from like midnight to the morning, like to make sure there was like no interference with the batches, like, you've like, you've been a like a night owl, like at certain stages, like I'm curious if you can kind of talk about how you've prioritized yourself, have you felt a lot of pressure to give up those, those things? And you know, like, just what has that been like, what does it look like? I think our, you know, listeners could, you know, just kind of really relate to, you know, any tips you have for for taking care of yourself so that you can, you know, you can keep doing what you love in the long run.
35:17 GT - Absolutely. Well, so the really is there's two things that I think you have to sort out when you're an entrepreneur is one is your health. Right. And that is subjective, because what keeps people mentally and physically healthy is not the same. It's not the same standard across everybody. Right. It's very subjective. So for me, it's sleep and exercise. And then what I should add is probably a third is, is obviously a good diet. But that to me kind of manages itself because over the course of the last few years, I've been able to develop some of the standard way of eating that I don't even have to think about it. But sleep and exercise requires more thought. And so that is like the health bucket. The other one, which is tricky because it's very contingent on where you are in your life. Because like, again, you know, I was very fortunate to start my business when I was a teenager. I, you know, therefore was very young. I didn't have a wife or kids or a mortgage or any of those kind of obligations or responsibilities. So I was able to, you know, yes, there was a don't get me wrong. There was a lot of sacrificing on my personal life. Like I had no friends, no social life, you know, not to get TMI, but I was like a virgin until like my early 20s because I didn't even have the opportunity to like date. I mean, I was basically like asexual. And so, you know, that was hard, but it was not an issue for me because the exchange of being able to build something that I loved was great. So in my mind, I had balance, even though to the outsider looking in, getting up at, as you mentioned, midnight is not normal. But it didn't affect me that way. I think where entrepreneurs have to be careful is yes, you've got to always take care of your health. And that is really important. Because if you're not healthy, you're not going to be very useful for your business. You know, because you're not going to be thinking clearly, you'll start getting sick, like only bad things will come. And that's why it's important to take care of your health. But on the other side of the spectrum, which is what I'm referencing more of these other responsibilities that are perhaps to family and friends and lovers, you know, you really have to manage expectations. And you need to make sure that, again, you're eyes wide open to the circumstances around you. So like, for example, if you're in a relationship or better yet, you have a family, you know, if you're seeing that what this hypothetically, this business you're about to start is going to require is going to take you away from your family or away from your loved ones, like, you're going to have to really sort that out up front and be really honest about it because people don't do that. And then they realize that it becomes a problem. And it can actually somewhat be somewhat cancerous to your professional growth, because there's something on the side that's like this black cloud, this unresolved issue that's starting to kind of rear its ugly head. And creating kind of an uncomfortable situation. So you have to really get in front of it and establish like get everything out in the open, get a lay of the land and almost establish certain guardrails. So you don't wake up and go, Oh, my God, I, I'm going through a divorce because I didn't spend enough time with my wife or my kids don't know who I am, because I didn't spend any time with them. You know, that's something that you want to get in front of and make certain commitments and so to avoid as much as you can, an unfortunate outcome there, because it's easy. It's easy to I say a lot of time like my business is my first born and my first marriage. And, you know, I say that to my husband and even to my kids sometimes, which is like, hey, like, I got to take care of this. It within reason. And so as long as everybody understands it, then I think things will be good. That understanding is critical.
38:55 Jessi - Mm hmm. Yeah, I appreciate that note on the just the upfront communication and laying it out there so that everyone knows what you're getting into. It's when like you said, it sits on the sidelines and simmers and that that clarity is super important. It really is. I'm also, you know, kind of going back to some early days of hiring, like, you know, what, what were some of your first hires in the in the company? Like, do you have any stories around maybe the first couple people you hired? Like, did you hire people first to help you make Did you hire, you know, people on the sales side? Like, you know, maybe your first couple, does it do any stand out to you as like, you know, big moments of of hiring and just kind of growing out your team in the early days?
39:36 GT - Yes, there definitely was. I mean, I had a variety of experiences and, you know, I think, again, because I'm such a perfectionist, I was reluctant to delegate the secret sauce, so to speak. So the actual making of kombucha was the last thing that I delegated because I felt, you know, that was the most special and then and needed therefore to be protected the most. So what I delegated initially was like the labeling, the delivery, the sales, all those things that really didn't affect the actual quality and integrity of the physical product. And then my big biggest moment, which took a while, to be honest, which was when I eventually found somebody that I could hire with confidence and trust to make the kombucha the way that it was. I would make it, which is with like 100% pure love and care and in the quality and all of that. And, you know, it took a while to relinquish that fear or concern about giving it to someone else. But once I was able to, it was a beautiful experience, so much like falling in love where you're like, wow, you know, now I know what everybody's talking about, or this feeling is like something I've never felt before. There was this beautiful moment of being able to delegate something as important as making my kombucha and then but also at the same time having confidence that it was going to go well. So that was a big moment, but to be honest, the biggest, which I'll say, which I'll share really quickly is I when I hired my first manager who was in charge of production, he got, he unfortunately started to have some problems at home where him and his wife were fighting. I think she might have been having an affair or something like that. Long story short, I was in a relationship with my wife. Long story short, he ended up having a heart attack at home one weekend and passed and passed away. And the reason why this is an important story is it actually references the sensitivity that kombucha has with how it's made and who is making it. So this individual's name was Alfredo. Alfredo seemed to be very unhappy because of his challenges at home for a minimum of two weeks. And so what happened was after he passed away, every batch that he made within that two week period of where he was very unhappy, they all turned moldy. And none of them, none of the cultures reproduced, none of the tea fermented, they basically just died. And so it was really interesting that it almost felt like, and this was an eye opening moment for me again, like, hey, you need to be very sensitive to who you let make your kombucha, because there's almost like a transfer of energy. And so it reminded me that he was unhappy, therefore his batches were unhappy, and therefore, they were not healthy, because they're lack of happiness. And so that was just, again, a permanent reminder of we I have to be very careful of who I let make the kombucha, because I was very happy. Because again, it's, it's a very personal expression. And it is a transfer of energy, like I said.
42:23 Jessi - Yeah, wow. Wow. That's really wild. Yeah. Yeah, really shows the yeah, the, I mean, all of your, your products are, you know, like the name, live living foods. So yeah, that's, that's wow. Are there any other like, you know, any other stories from some of those first few hires that you had? Or, you know, anything that you any big learnings that you had, like from employees that you, you hired as you scaled? I'm just Yeah, I'm super, I'm always super curious of stories from those kind of, you know, when you're kind of under 10 employees, those those first few hires always seem really, you know, critical, informative to a business.
43:01 GT - They really are. And again, it goes, I can't stress enough the importance of ensuring alignment, you know, physically, philosophically, spiritually, you know, all of that. Because once you have that, you almost feel like you're a family. And I know, you know, family, the term family can be sometimes overused in business and somewhat misused. But, you know, certainly when you're 10 or smaller, you need to have that family vibe, right? You everybody needs to have that family vibe. And you need to feel connected and valued and part of something bigger than them. Because with that, like, just, I don't know, there's just something magical happens. It can't be transactional, like you can't be having just nine or 10 individuals that are there just because of a paycheck, because it will show. And so in my opinion, whether it's 10 or 10 people or 10,000 people, it gets harder as you scale. Because I mean, I'll admit, like, I don't know the names of every employee that I employ. I once did, but now I, I just can't. And so that's just case in point that it's in that it's inevitable that as you grow, you can't be exactly the same as you were when you were smaller. But generally speaking, you can't I mean, I, I really encourage my management team to do that. I encourage my management team to have a relationship with their direct reports, as if we were, you know, a 10 person company. So there's ways to do it, but you got to put forth the effort and it's easier said than done.
46:36 Jessi - Mm hmm. Yeah, yeah. How do you kind of, you know, kind of in that area of, you know, staying, staying on track of everything and you mentioned kind of like how hard it is to, you know, give up certain parts of, of the business, like when you were initially having someone else make the, you know, making the product, like, you know, do you have any tips for, you know, for founders navigating, like the different aspects of the business, like, you know, you're eventually you're hiring experts in these, these different functions. And for you, like, what has it looked like to kind of educate yourself in a function like marketing, for example, but also hire experts in that area and manage those experts? Like, do you have any tips for kind of how you stay on top of like, what's the right path forward also trusting the people that you hired, like, it can be kind of tricky to navigate and wonder if anything comes to mind for you.
47:25 GT - You're right. It can be very tricky. And I think what's very important, because this is actually where a lot of companies screw things up, right? As they get bigger, they start bringing in these outside resources, these experts, these consultants, these advisors, and they sometimes just take their advice blindly because they go, you know, this guy has an MBA or this guy has an impressive resume or this gal did all these great things. And I think, yes, that's important. But, you know, what, what my personal advice is, is that you have to be able to do the right thing. And I think that's important. My personal approach has been as, like, as I said earlier, is every brand and entrepreneur needs to have his or her North Star. And the North Star is this is why I'm doing this. This is why I got into this. And this is what I'm looking to accomplish. And you almost it almost has to be like your constitution where you like write it down, and you don't change it. And you put it in like a glass case and it, it's like, it's basically gospel. And so like, for me, like, I always wanted to make great products. That improves people’s health and lives. And is really honoring Mother Nature. And that was and is my North Star. And so when, you know, a lot of times when these advisors come in, they, they, they, there's always exceptions. So this is something that again, is just a general statement. But they typically come in with like the same approach, which is like, all right, let's cut costs. And let's get lean. Or let's grow faster. And it's almost like I call it like the steroid approach. And I say that because like, I'm a fitness guy, and I've never done steroids. And I've seen guys and gals that have and yeah, they look great initially. But it's such a shortcut that at some point, something bad happens, right. And so that's what happens when when these individuals come into the picture is they come in with a different mindset that's almost hyper focused on, you know, explosive growth, or increasing profitability, and listen, profit and purpose don't coexist really well. And so I guess what I'm saying is you need to be like super explicit with the guardrails, the non negotiables, and make sure that that's clear to everyone, yourself, your employees, and these now outside individuals that are coming in so they can't and won't even try to mess it up. Because that's what my experience was, is I, you know, early on, because I had no business background, I wanted to get advisors. And one of my first advisors was actually a good friend of mine who was older, but and very, very experienced. He was like a CEO of a very respectable company. And his first advice was, you need to put your product in plastic. And I was like, why? And he said, Oh, because your profits will just quadruple. He's like, classic is four cents to five cents a bottle and glasses 25 to 30 cents a bottle like do the math. And I said that, yeah, that's right. But my products won't be good anymore. Right. So it violated and this is what I'm getting that it violated that like constitutional belief of like, we need to make the best product possible. And so because I had that I was able to reference it and said, Hey, plastic would change the flavor of my product, adversely change it. And therefore that violates this constitutional position that I've established for myself. So I won't do it. Even if it means I'm turning my back on millions of dollars of additional profit. So that's where that's just an example of how I think entrepreneurs have to navigate the world of making sure that you like triple check and double verify the advice that you're getting. And you really kind of compare contrasted to your the values that you established early on and that hopefully are still in place. Because then that will help you that will actually give you all the insight and the guidance and the directions that you need. You know, it's that kind of that instinct of does this feel right? Or does this feel wrong?
51:12 Jessi - I like the reference to like, you know, it's kind of like a brand constitution and a company personal and in for the company because I think that, you know, as especially when you're small, you it's basically a barrage every day of advice and things that people say and you can get conflicting advice in the same day from two different experts to say, do this, do this, do this. And unless you've really written down and, you know, and internalized, you know, where you want to have your different stakes in the ground and lines in the sand be for you, it can be really easy to just kind of get pushed off of the original path that you were meaning to, you know, you can still be well meaning, but you just didn't kind of set up a firm enough firm enough boundaries for yourself. And pretty soon you're wandering down a path that you didn't mean to be wandering down.
51:59 Jessi - That also reminds me of, you know, you have you managed like, um, you know, massive brand ambassador force, like I have been walking around in multiple cities, and someone has come up to me and handed me a bottle of kombucha. And they are always just a static upbeat, like it's always such a, you know, positive experience. And I'm curious about like, you know, if there's what goes into managing that, like, what's the most important thing to do? And that as a company, what kind of strategies did you have you thought through of, you know, teaching people about kombucha and getting it in people's hands? You know, because sampling and education about a product is really important. And I'm sure it's, you know, shifted and grown over the past few years, but kind of curious about your perspective on, you know, kind of that your brand ambassadors out in the world, anything really intentional that you think of for, you know, hiring, maintaining, educating that those group of people out in the world, you know, representing you with your, you know, your name on the products. And yeah, kind of curious about your thoughts on that piece.

53:02 GT - Yeah, I mean, it really comes down to, again, making sure that you're working with like minded individuals that share a similar passion or philosophy. So, you know, what we somewhat deploy to ensure that anybody from brand ambassador to somebody running the bottling line, that they, you know, are subscribing to a similar philosophy. Is that first and foremost, you know, we believe that health is wealth, that being healthy and being happy and feeling good are the most important thing. Because if you don't have those things, nothing else matters. It doesn't matter how rich, famous, popular, good looking you are, because all of those things will eventually fade if you're not healthy and happy. And so, and again, that's not a radical way of thinking. It's unfortunately, at times becoming the less popular way of thinking as we're in such a narcissistic materialistic world these days. But generally speaking, there's still a community of people that understand that being happy and healthy is the most important. And so those are those are the individuals that we like to work with. And, and again, like I said earlier, then you don't really have to teach them anything, as far as their behavior. You don't have to teach them to be happy. You don't have to teach them to be kind. You don't have to teach them to be passionate. It's just, you know, it's part of who they are. What you do teach them is like the knowledge on the product and some of the technical stuff that, you know, it's important for them to know. But the energy that they put off like that what you references when you you've encountered our brand ambassadors, how they're they're happy and kind and all of that, like, that's just because that's that's who we try to cultivate. And, and we've been fortunate, and there's always exceptions where sometimes things change, and we have to make a change. But more often than not, I think we do a really good job of establishing the appropriate criteria for who we want to work with. And that criteria really ensures that we're working with great people that are going to behave beautifully no matter what, and really represent the brand and and help further kind of our ethos.
54:59 Jessi - Mhm. Are there any like really like, I don't know, like really tactical pieces in there that have helped you scale scale up a program like that? Like, you know, is it specific screening questions? Or like, because I think you know, and this applies to all hiring, but I feel like especially with like, brand ambassadors out in the world like, you know, a brand will manage a few and then you know, maybe get to, you know, 10 and then you know, like, like, 10 people. Like, as you keep growing, it just, it becomes more and more difficult. And as the founder maybe gets more separated from the process, like, is there anything really tactical or from like a process perspective that you found helpful to like, make sure that, you know, as like a process person, I'm always thinking about that of like, you know, you how do you make that pro how do you have a process that supports the culture coming through like, you know, from a tactical perspective?
55:52 GT - Yeah, I mean, it really actually kind of goes back to what we were talking about earlier about not growing too fast. And so, you know, there actually was a time and this was right before the pandemic, where as much as I'm embarrassed to admit it is there was a time where not every single one of our brand ambassadors was meeting the quality standard that we had set for the brand and the company. And it obviously wasn't intentional, it was something that I then discovered later on. And it's because, you know, as long as lo and behold, we grew too fast, right in 2018 and 2019. We had all these opportunities presented to us like Coachella came to us and wanted us to present at Coachella for free, but wanted us to curate this like kombucha garden, and so forth and so forth. So we were almost like, forced to a certain degree to kind of like triple our brand ambassador head count. And that can translate into hyper growth and growing too fast. And so in that, there was a time where we didn't necessarily have the type of quality of brand ambassadors that we needed. And so we learned from that. So now to answer your question, I think the best way to maintain it is again, it's just to be very steady and thoughtful about it. You know, if you're hiring 10 people, it's easy to kind of screen them and be patient with who you get versus hiring 100 people. And so that goes back to kind of the rule of thumb. That is a consistent theme, I think in this conversation is entrepreneurs have to be mindful, they have to be patient, and they have to be somewhat conservative with how quickly they grow and what they do to support that growth. And, and then again, when you do that, you're able to maintain your values, your integrity, and ultimately your quality standards.
57:33 Jessi - Mm hmm. Yeah, yeah, that's, that's super interesting. I'm also wondering if you if you have any advice, it's kind of related to, you know, brand ambassadors and educating people about your product. You know, when you started, Kombucha hadn't been wasn't available in bottles. And so I'm curious about, you know, now you have helped build out this industry, which is incredible. And we have other you know, we have founders in our community that are that are, you know, some some of them are operating in existing categories for sure, but some are kind of venturing into a new territory, a new category that doesn't really exist yet. And I wonder if you have any tips around that? Or, you know, if there was any kind of, you know, maybe frustration is the wrong word, but just like, you know, like, how do I get people to know about like, I know my products incredible, how do I get people to even give it a shot, like to get them to try it, I know they're going to like it, like any advice for kind of, you know, that you wish you could go back and give yourself of, you know, building out a basically a new category.
58:34 GT - Well, you know, it's interesting, we're still kind of going through it, not with kombucha, per se. But there's a degree there, which I'll share in a minute. But I mean, if you look at our portfolio of products, whether it's like our raw coconut yogurt, or our mushroom, ancient mushroom elixir, which is our live, or our raw water kefir, and so forth, and so forth. I mean, we actually I actually really, for better or for worse, I'm more interested in the raw water kefir. I'm more interested and intrigued with creating something that the world has not seen yet before versus creating something that the world has already seen. And so, so you're so I can answer your question from ongoing experience. I mean, when you're creating something new, that's quote unquote, like that, you're creating a category, so to speak, you have to be patient, right? Because it's not going to happen overnight. It's not like selling like, you know, the next coconut water, the next cold brew, that people already know. You're, you're kind of exposing them to something that they've never seen before. And the human nature typically is somewhat a little bit fearful of things that we don't understand. And so new things can sometimes fall into that category. So that's what I went through with kombucha. But I'm going through that even with our mushroom elixir. So I guess that the short answer is, you got to be patient, you got to be passionate. And what I mean by that is you have to be convicted in your belief of this is why I'm doing this. And this is why I'm doing it this way. And this is, you know, what I want the world to benefit from. That has to be like absolutely positively unwavering. So because when you have, again, the patience and the passion, then the third thing is you can't be greedy. And I and it's a little bit synonymous with the patience is that, you know, it's your, your, it's sometimes easy for entrepreneurs, and it's certainly applied to me to a certain degree, that when you're starting something new, you're looking around you, and you're still you're seeing success in other areas of your world, perhaps, like, let's say, you know, like when I was doing kombucha, what was popular around me was vitamin water. And vitamin water was like growing ridiculously, and then ultimately sold to Coke for 4 billion. So if if I was, you know, again, that could have potentially frustrated me that here, you know, I'm taking the slow and steady path and this other brand just like blew up overnight. And then it's sold for billions. So that's why you can't be greedy. Like what I always use is what my, my fulfillment then and now is, is my fulfillment of doing what I do comes from knowing that I'm making the best products that I can make. And that it's helping people's lives. It's not I'm making the most money that I can make or I'm the richest or the most famous like that's not important. And so that helps me stay focused and not get too tempted or too persuaded or even too discouraged by the success that's around me. So I'm able to be passionate, patient, and somewhat humble with my expectations. And in that way, I can kind of weather any storm.
01:01:30 Jessi - Mm hmm. Yeah, oh, that's great. And yeah, I'm what you know, for for a line like the the alive mushroom elixirs or like I was just able to try the Agua de Kefir the other day at Target, I the branding is stunning. I saw it on the shelf. I was like, I immediately need to buy this. I bought the prickly pear version. And then I was like, I wonder who this is by and I turned it over and I was like, of course it's by my you know, one of the favorites, you know, who else would come up with this incredible branding and flavor and another amazing living food. It was no surprise once I you know, turned over the bottle. But you know, what are you thinking about with those you know, from an education perspective, like what does that look like from a, you know, marketing perspective? Like what is your what are you working through with your marketing team to think about building out like for the sales team? Like is there anything you know, since you've gone through the process with kombucha, are there specific kind of tactical things and different functions that you're thinking through? Like, oh, let's, let's equip the sales team with this or the marketing team with this, like, you know, kind of curious about anything from those those current products that you're building out.
01:02:33 GT - Yeah, you know, it is is that I first of all, thank you for what you said earlier, because I created Agua de Kefir from scratch and the branding was kind of my personal creation. And so I loved it, you resonated with it. So, you know, whenever I create something, whether it's a flavor within like our synergy line or a brand new product line, you know, it's almost always coming from a personal place of, you know, I want I have a certain need state, right. So with like, Agua de Kefir, I created that because I'm because I wanted something that was a was a living beverage that had naturally occurring nutrients in it, like kombucha does. But I didn't want I wanted to have a different flavor profile, different use occasion, you know, I can maybe have it at night, have it with food, use it to hydrate because you know, kombucha is actually not hydrating because it's so cleansing, it's more of a diuretic. And so, you know, I look at my life and my health holistically, and I don't believe that any one thing is the silver bullet, right, everything kind of collectively plays into your overall health. And so, you know, a lot of the products we create come from a personal need state that I have. And then the way I try to design them and ultimately position them are almost like, again, not to belabor the analogy, but almost like having different children, right, like, I didn't, I never want to have five twins, you know, I want to have a beautiful, diverse family, that each offspring has its own identity and its own personality, and then subsequently, kind of its own place in the world. And so that's how I see our portfolio. So that's why there's an explicit degree of attention and effort putting put into making them look unique, giving them their own kind of use occasion of hydration versus, you know, other stuff, and then also allowing them to have their own personality. Is that something that I, it might be a little bit unconventional, I think, but, you know, I think brands need to be consistent. But I don't think brands should ever, I think brands need to be careful that they're not being used. And so when I started to my first product I created outside of Synergy was alive. And the mistake that I made back in 2017, when I first launched it, is it looked a lot like a synergy. And, and that's because I was being told, like, you need to be consistent, like the brand, like look and feel means to kind of thread, like almost overtly across everything that you do. And so I took that advice, but it was actually bad advice. For me, at least, because it was very confusing for the consumer. They didn't know what this was, or they thought they knew what it was, but they what they thought it was was wrong. So long story short, you know, I've learned that for us, at least delineating different positions and paths for each product to kind of have its own identity is the best, what is the best thing to do for us as well as the best thing for the consumer. So they have that diversity, if that makes sense.
01:05:27 Jessi - Mm hmm. Yeah, that makes, that makes a lot of sense. And yeah, I was actually I was having dinner with a friend the other night and I was mentioning that this interview was coming up. And she was like, Oh, is that like you like the kombucha? Like, I think it's the same brand maybe that makes the like the alive the mushroom, like, that is my favorite drink. But you know, I'll have to try the kombucha because I did, you know, I didn't quite make the connection that they were the same brand. And so I thought that was the best thing to do for me. Yeah, I thought that was really interesting. And to hear you talk about how like each product kind of like is allowed to have its own personality. And it's not just about, you know, kind of putting the same logo on on every product across because it's not giving each product kind of the chance to, to be its own thing. And for consumers understand that they're very different products with very different use cases. And so that's really interesting to kind of hear the strategy. Yeah, I'm, I'm also wondering, you know, you have your your name, GT is on every single bottle, all your products, GT is living foods. And, you know, as the company has grown, you know, obviously, you know, you are a market leader, you've been featured in about every major publication. And I'm wondering for you as as you've grown, like, what has it been like to kind of become, you know, to have to have kind of a public presence and for people to see your name everywhere and kind of have formed, you know, there are own versions of you in their mind or from listening to interviews or whatever, like, has that been, is that difficult to like manage? Is there anything you've had that you do to kind of stay centered or to just, you know, you know, know, stay true to yourself? Like, I just feel like it'd be really surreal to have your name and you know, just across the world and have so many people have seen your name, you know, I'm just curious about that.
01:07:05 GT - Yeah, it's definitely interesting. I mean, especially for me, because as I mentioned earlier, I didn't get started to get famous, right. And by the way, I still don't think I'm famous, but I think everything is somewhat relative. And so, therefore, there wasn't a desire to be a public figure in any shape or size. But I think with an entrepreneur, as soon as you start growing your business, you quickly realize that, okay, I need to behave like a leader. Because there's people that look up to me. So whether that's, you know, again, if you're a company of 10, you still have nine or 10 people looking up to you. So there's a leadership role that you almost immediately fall into. And I think when you're being a leader, it sets you up for somewhat of a public figure position because you're, you know, you're, you're tasked with leading by example or being look up to or being somebody that has to have the answers to the questions or the guidance that people need. And so by the time, fortunately, I was able to somewhat stay under the radar as a public figure for like the first 15 years of my career. And so I was able to somewhat groom myself or prepare myself to ultimately be a little bit more of a public figure when that happened, which that really did happen, I think, in 2000. I think it was 2018 and 2019, where I think some of the things that I was doing or saying or participating were a little bit more public facing. And then I think the popular, the brand was growing to an all time high. So those two together put me more in the public side. But at the end of the day, I mean, like I said, I didn't start this to be famous. So I don't, I don't put a lot of equity in any kind of fame or any kind of public perception of me. I mean, I obviously don't want to be perceived as a horrible person. You know, but like, I could take or leave the followers on Instagram or the followers on LinkedIn or whatever platform. What I just want to make sure is that people, and this is actually was something that pushed me more into the public side of it. I've learned that if people don't know who you are, they especially for a company like mine, they can sometimes think that this is just a faceless corporation. Right? Because there's a lot of those right now where even in the health and wellness space, it's, they play the game of saying like, oh, this is coming from founders or founders type of story or mission. But in reality, it's just like, it's actually like Coke or Pepsi wearing a disguise. So I learned that early on. I think that's what I was trying to do. I think that it's important for me to be somewhat conspicuous with the fact that this isn't a faceless corporation. GT is the name of a person, a human being that started this and what you're buying or drinking or supporting is an extension of his philosophy. Therefore, I think it's important that you understand, you know, where everything's coming from. So you have that context. That in addition to, I've learned that if an entrepreneur is too quiet, that someone could inadvertently steal their voice and therefore change, start changing the narrative. And so we started seeing that in our industry a few years ago, and I think that was yet another reason why I felt more obligated to lean into a consumer facing conversation. Because I really wanted to make sure that people were getting things from my mouth and from from in hearing my side versus getting somewhat unsubstantiated information, somewhat fake news from it from another source.
01:10:22 Jessi - Yeah, yeah, that's really interesting. And I, I mean, as a as someone that has, you know, has seen you as a public figure, and, you know, followed you and appreciated the kind of connection to your product. And I always appreciate that, you know, you, you do seem to, you know, you are out there answering questions, you're out there sharing your story. And like, I think it was a couple years ago, there was one media outlet kind of had a interest, you know, they had cut up an interview with you and in a way, that kind of had a particular focus to it. And there was a YouTuber that kind of reacted and you just reached out to them and said, Hey, come to my house, come hang out. Let's you know, let's hang out and have kombucha. And then they published that video. And like, that was just so fun that you just like you kind of took a narrative that, you know, someone was kind of trying to push you down and show people that you were this one version and you just you just kind of reacted and say, Hey, no, come get to know the real me. And I really enjoyed, you know, seeing that and just, you know, seeing you get to have have fun. And just, you know, kind of show yourself for who you are. So I think that that's so cool.
01:11:23 GT - Yeah, I think it's important just to be real. Because at the end of the day, like, I'm a human, just like you, you know, I have my hopes, dreams, wishes and fears just like you. And I think it's important for people to see entrepreneurs and you know, people that we kind of put on a pedestal as humans. Because then it just it shows that we have that same vulnerability that you have. And then it helps us relate to each other.
01:11:45 Jessi - Yeah, which leads into my last couple questions are just a little bit more like fun, like goofy, because you know, after like following you, the first one is, is like, I believe you've had some like interesting pets, like I think you I've seen you with an owl, I've seen you with the bunny. And like, I'm curious, like, do you still like what pets do you have now? Like, you know, are your are your kids into pets? Like, what's, you know, what's the most interesting thing that you've seen? What's pet life at the at the house like now?
01:12:11 GT - It's a really great question. So right now, it's actually pretty calm. And we just have one bunny. I like bunnies, because I grew up with bunnies when I was a young boy. And they unfortunately didn't live very long, because we lived up in the hills. So somehow, some way like the coyotes, the owls would get to them. And so they would never last very long. But as an adult, I was gifted a bunny and was able to now protect her and she's, she actually lived up to the age of 11. And then she passed away at the beginning of this year. So I got another bunny. So that's funny that you probably saw in the Forbes video that you referenced a minute ago. Her name was Madonna. And then I replaced her with a new bunny when she unfortunately passed away with another bunny named gizmo. And they, you know, they're part of the family, the kids love them. I think it's important that children are can interact with another living thing because then they understand the sensitivity and care and thought that needs to go into not only interacting with them, but ultimately even taking care of them. At some point, we want to get a dog, because we also think that's the next stage of animal life with children. But that's in LA. In Hawaii, where I have a home, there's thought to develop a little bit of a ranch because we have some extra land. So you want to get some chickens want to get maybe like a miniature bowl. Or like a little goat or something like that. Because, I mean, again, I think animals certainly are an extension of nature. And I think they have such a gentleness and a selflessness to them. And in many ways, they almost have like an unconditional love. I think it's really important for humans in general, but specifically young humans like children to interact with because I think it develops character and perspective.
01:13:56 Jessi - Yeah, oh, absolutely. Yeah, thank you for sharing about that. That's because yeah, I as someone that you know, grew up on a farm, like we had horses and you know, a bunny and cats and dogs and even a bird at one point. And I think that that was so just pivotal to growing up. And yeah, you develop a certain gentleness and just understanding of, you know, how you impact other other beings and creatures and how you can impact for good and for not good. And so I think that's really important. Yeah, that's that's really cool. Exactly. And my other fun question is, I believe, you know, from online that you are you seem quite into Halloween dressing up, I've seen an incredible hellraiser costume that you did to face like, I've seen the families the Flintstones like, is there a Halloween costume like either for you or as a family that you're like, I hope we get to do this like in a future Halloween.
01:14:50 GT - Oh, boy. Well, first of all, I love Halloween because it's close to my birthday. And then I also love it because, you know, I think it's, I think it's really impressive when humanity takes on a different identity and and allows that temporarily, that temporary new identity to allow them to kind of change their perspective, even if it's just for one evening. So that's why I really love like the dressing up process. Wow, of a costume that I that I hope I get to be we know, it's funny, I kind of dictate the costumes because as you with the the two costumes that you reference to face and then pinhead, they were part of the theme of an event that I host every year that we dubbed fright night. So it's a Halloween party that I host for, you know, 800 of my closest friends. And, and I like to establish a general theme. It's not a costume that I get to be. It's not a mandatory theme, it's somewhat directional. But like, I did like the superheroes, supervillains, which is the two faced one. And then I did the Addams Family one, which was just more goblins and ghouls right to pinhead. So this upcoming party, I'm doing like a like a crazy killer clown slash haunted circus type vibe. So I guess I don't know if I'm answering your question, but I'm trying to actually think of what my costume is going to be. I haven't decided. What are the things that allow you to be to allow you to disappear and to take on again that that identity for that night. So I don't sorry, I don't know if I have a good answer for you right now.
01:16:50 Jessi - That's okay. It's super interesting to hear your kind of perspective behind that. And I, I love to dress up. And so you know, when I've seen that from from you, I thought that that would be fun to hear a little bit more about. So that's awesome. And then, you know, I guess my, you know, a kind of final question just would be, you know, you've done so many interviews, and I've listened to so many of them. And I'm grateful for all the time that you've shared for, you know, people like me to listen and learn the story behind products that we love, like, is there anything that you know, you've wished that you've been asked or that you don't get a chance to talk about, you know, as much as that you'd like, I just wanted to give you a chance to share anything that you know, you're like, man, nobody ever asked me this, and I've always wanted to share about it.
01:16:55 GT - Wow, that's a great question. Um, I mean, I think I actually have been able to share a lot about my life in recent times. I'm grateful for that. I mean, I guess the part that I never that I feel that you can never overemphasize is again, the love and care, and humility and thoughtfulness that goes into what we do. You know, I think in this day and age, it's easy to overlook that because there's so much noise in the marketplace, where whether that's social media, whether it's online, whether it's in other areas that I think even like the best brands can get misunderstood. And I think sometimes we inadvertently get pulled into that equation of people thinking like we're a giant brand that sold everywhere that has all the success. So we must be the bad guys or we must be in it for the money or there must be like a big brand behind us kind of being the puppet master. And so I always just try to go out there and go out of my way to say, that's actually not the case. And, you know, we are, yes, we're sizable in our market share and where we sell our products, but we're still very small in everywhere else like our the way we behave is very small company, the way we create very small company. You know, our values are very like small company, like we're not greedy, we're not trying to take over the world or anything like that. Like, we just want to make great products that will really change and improve the lives of people who enjoy them. And we really want to create things that in many ways kind of are are somewhat provocative, if that makes sense, where they, they encourage people to look at their lives differently and reassess things differently or, you know, get new questions or find answers to certain questions or challenge the status quo. And so that's really who we are. And I think it's, it's hard, it's hard to convey that sometimes through a label or through a website or through a social media. So I think that's the one thing and thank you for the opportunity that if I had the mic time, you know, that's what I would always want to put out is like we are like the truest definition of a purpose driven brand. And I and that's the number one priority I want people to have. And I think that's the number one thing that I want people to take away from.
01:19:33 Jessi - Yeah, I love that. And I mean, I'm, I feel like a personal testimonial for you know, the impact of the brand of like, you know, having the having a kombucha most days is always an opportunity of reflection for me and a reminder to, you know, to take care of my body and think about what's going to make me feel good. So I think, you know, some of the stories, you stories you've had, like the, you know, the the Bloom series that you've done and like, you know, everything you that you're you and your team put out in the world kind of is it is an opportunity for reflection. So I feel personally kind of impacted by the you know, the purpose that you've put out in the world. So I think that's really cool to hear.
01:19:39 GT - Thank you. And thanks for all the support. It means so much to me.
01:19:43 Jessi - Awesome. Well, is there any other like, you know, products or, you know, things coming out this year that we should be on the lookout? Like, I think there's a new smaller size that I saw a tease that, you know, Walgreens, everyone, you know, if they if for some reason, somehow, they haven't had the products that I'll make sure the links are all in the show notes. But you know, anything that you want to tease that you know, that people should be keeping an eye out for this year?
01:20:04 GT - Yeah, I mean, I actually really appreciate the opportunity to say something because we have we actually have a lot going on right now. And we have our island bliss synergy that we debuted earlier this year, which was inspired by my travels to Hawaii, specifically the island of Kauai. You know, we have the agro de kefir that you reference, which is brand new. It's right now it's only sold to Target. But later this year, you'll see that other stores. That's a really special product because it's low in sugar and super hydrating and super great for your energy levels, your gut health and your hydration. The live medicinal mushroom elixir that we make, I mean, we have these incredible soda flavors like root beer and cola and lemon lime, which is like a basically a seven up. And for those, I mean, it's really remarkable, because I think a lot of us stop drinking soda because we associate with like unhealthy beverages, but we've been we're slowly trying to change the script on that or the narrative on that because our live tastes just like a soda, but it's so healthy for you. And then last but not least, our own our cocoa. Yo, I mean, we make this. It's really a labor of love more than anything, because it's not easy to make. But we take two young Thai coconuts and we crack them ourselves in Los Angeles and then make this like delicate, fluffy, delicious, raw coconut yogurt that makes every other yogurt look like a pudding. And, you know, when people try it, they have this like incredible reaction because it's like something you've never tried before. So, you know, I just encourage you and your listeners to please check these out and let us know what you think because we really do put our hearts and souls into everything we make, like I said, and always want to hear what people think about what we're making.
01:21:41 Jessi - Yeah, amazing. Yeah, and I, I got to try the island bliss. It was incredible. It was everything that I wanted it to be. It was absolutely amazing. I have the peach cocoa yo in the fridge at home. Also just phenomenal. So yeah, I hope that everyone gets to try new products and appreciate you, you sharing about them. This has just been so wonderful GT. Thank you so so much for sharing. And you know, taking this time to share with our community and on our show specifically, it means so much to us. Thank you so much. I'm just, you know, I'm so grateful to you and for your team and just, you know, everything that you've you've done in the world. I'm so grateful. So thank you so so much.
01:22:19 GT - My pleasure. Thank you again for having me on and thanks for listening to me.