The Startup CPG Podcast

Tim Dornfeld
Yeah. So, I mean, I think what we can do is we can help to kind of consult. I've always felt like the. The category management role, as much as we're, you know, supplier facing and innovating, there's a lot of, like, education and consultation that we do with especially newer and emerging brands. Right. So it's helping them to understand, especially if they're new to retail, like, what is sort expected of them. There is some of that where the retailers would like the fact that we are able to help advise these brands, make them a little bit more retail ready, especially the new and emerging brands that haven't necessarily gone through the retail space.

00:47
Daniel Scharff
Welcome. Welcome, everybody. Today we're going to learn all about KHE distributors. It's one of the most important pieces of the CPG ecosystem. And we've got the perfect guest. Tim Dornfeld. He is a director of category management at KHE. He joined them in 2019 as a category manager. He's overseen nutrition bars, shelf stable beverage, pet products, and general merchandise, and became a director in 2023. Before that, he actually worked at Nestle Purina. So he understands both the supplier and distributor sides of the business. Today we are going to talk all things kahe. How do they work? How can you approach them? What's the best way to grow with them? What should you watch out for? And lots of insider tips.

01:22
Daniel Scharff
I hope all of you get the chance to meet and become friends with a bunch of the people at khe, because they are really some of my favorites. All right, y'all enjoy. All right, Tim, my friend, let's just jump right into it. What do you wish every brand knew about working with the distributor?

01:40
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, that's a great question. I guess a good way to start. I think the thing that I wish everybody kind of understood is that once you get into working with a distributor like ke, like, in a lot of ways, the work is just beginning. Right. I think a lot of people look at it almost like kind of like an end game. Like, okay, I have to get into KE or a distributor, right? And people need to understand or. And they certainly learn, you know, once they get in there. Is that. All right, great. Now we got this platform, like, how do I make it work with my brand? What do I need to put in place? Like, what are the different things that I need to do to. To not just get into KHI or distributor, but stay in there?

02:14
Daniel Scharff
Right.

02:14
Tim Dornfeld
And I think it's the same thing for a retailer as well. And that as a distributor, our primary Function, right, is to get your product from our warehouse to our retail partners. Right. And deliver product. Right. We're transportation. That doesn't mean though that there's not opportunities for us to partner with you and help support you in your goal to help expand and grow within K. And I think that it's important to know that as a brand, like brands that are really successful are the ones that are like say, leading the sales effort, maybe working with a broker, having somebody to help support and then utilizing the tools that Khe has, whether it be our accounts team, our growth solutions team, the promotion opportunities that we have, our shows to help support that effort.

02:54
Tim Dornfeld
Because like, I was like, you know, tell people, listen, as much as I might love your brand or our sales team, nobody's gonna be as passionate about your brand as you are or your team. Right? So I think it's just. Just know that you're gonna really kind of the effort here and we're here to support you. Like I said, our job is to help grow your brand and we all win if we do that. But that's kind of something that I think Brad should keep in mind when coming on board.

03:16
Daniel Scharff
That makes sense. And I would maybe add on to that. You being the one who cares the most and are the most passionate, you can actually get a lot of really great Khe people on your side 100%. Something just really underappreciated going into it is how many people at Khe can become champions for you, impact even your ability to get into retailers. How many account managers are the buyers, right hand person or get you a special look with the Sprouts innovation set. I mean, I just, I've seen a lot of this even because Khee came and met with a bunch of brands from our community during Fancy Foods recently. And there were so many opportunities that came from that, from accounts just like, yeah, this is actually a good product. We're going to try to get in front of this team, like, whoa.

03:54
Daniel Scharff
Just like those brands are really going to flourish, I think because of it.

03:57
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah. No, I think that's another thing that people, you know, probably underestimate is just how passionate people that work at a place like Khir to help build and promote and grow brands within the natural channel. Like our category management team. Like, this is like the group of like 30 most passionate people when it comes to this part of the business that I've come across. And so, yeah, we do care. We want your brand to succeed. We want you to grow. Right. And so utilize the different tools and People at KHI to help do that as well. We're here to partner with you at the end of the day.

04:28
Daniel Scharff
I definitely think that's true. And back to the first time I met pretty much anybody from kahee, my friend Cas Lucio, she found out about our. The brand that I was running at the time, and we got on a call and she just cared so much about it. She was so interested to find out about the product and our social mission, helping kids also. And yeah, I think that's really true. And something that people underestimate is just how much the category managers care about these products, you know, not just like big, daunting decision makers. Like, really? No, they care a lot.

04:58
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah. And it's probably why sometimes you were frustrating to deal with. If you're a brand that we don't feel you're quite ready yet, it's not done out of malice or it's literally done because we hate seeing brands fail. Like, we take it personally. So you're getting kind of some pushback, like, it's okay. The door is not closed. Take the feedback and let's come back around and bring in when you're ready.

05:17
Daniel Scharff
Okay. So a few years ago at the KHE show, every single person I met from KHE really did care. I became so aware of that it's a B corp, that there are so many company initiatives out there, like KAHI Cares. Can you tell me what is it like working for KHI as a B corp, and what are some of the company initiatives that you're most proud of?

05:36
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, I think when I think about what I'm most proud of, it's the fact that whether it be the KHI Cares Organization, the fact that we are a B corp, or just even our culture in general, part of that culture is to try to serve, to make the world a better place, whether it be through food or for the different forms of outreach that we're able to do through our KHI Cares organization. Again, as a B Corp, we are reinvesting percentages of our profit that organization makes back into the KI Care organization. And what this allows us to do is whether it be working in locally, here, in our communities, around the Chicagoland area, where we have other KHI folks, or going internationally. Last year alone, we sent over 200 people on 11 serving trips around the world.

06:16
Tim Dornfeld
And like I said, the KAHI folks, they literally get down in the mud, Right? So they're digging latrines in Honduras. You know, we'd send people to Nepal to help work with women who have been part of trafficking, helping displaced people. We have a rapid response team when there's, you know, natural disasters. So we can go and help things like that in real time. And even if you're not doing like a KHI care serving trip, right, Part of what the organization encourages you to do is get involved with your community. So here in the west side of Chicago, we've gone to different block parties that are being held and we'll go and we'll work the food line or help manage the basketball tournament they're having there. You know, at our shows, we every year we partner with Hanson Faso to do like a serving event.

06:57
Tim Dornfeld
You know, this year we packed cold weather kits to give to people who are unhoused or otherwise displaced. So I think what I'm proudest of is it's not just kind of an afterthought, it's truly part of the DNA of the company. And you know, as KAHI employees, you're encouraged your whole self to work, to get out there in the community and to just help make the world a better place. And I think, you know, I've worked at a number of companies and a lot of them have done a lot of really great work, but it's never been quite at the forefront like it is here with kahi.

07:26
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, it's a really beautiful thing and I think it reflects in everybody who I've met who works for Kahe. They care not just about themselves, but about entrepreneurs and products in the world as a whole. And I, I think it's a also just a really important thing for founders to remember. Like, maybe you're not getting the response back from your category manager in time. Like, what are the people that are just like, man, screw that. Like, these are good people, they're nice people, they want to do well with you, they want to be good partners to you. And just like anybody, everyone has tons of priorities. But I think it's like, it just, I think because I just never thought of a distributor that way. That's why it was so surprising to me to learn about KE being a B corp.

08:01
Daniel Scharff
And then yeah, at the show, just meeting everybody from all across the business from the sustainability practice, from the account teams who just like, I mean, I just such a strong culture, I think, across the company. So very cool. And also on that topic of the KHE show, I did not get to go this year, but I heard it was bumping really good show this year. Can you maybe explain to everybody what a KEHI show is?

08:22
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, absolutely. So we run two main shows a year. So we have our summer show, which we like to run in February, and then we run our holiday show in June. And so that's always fun because that always throws people off a little bit. But they're great opportunities for brands of all sizes, all life cycle to come and really meet the people within the Kahe community. Right. And when I'm talking about, that's retailers, right? So we had over 900 retail personnel at the last show, representing over 2,000 physical locations. But in addition to that, you're going to meet, you need your category managers there, your supplier manager is there, our sales teams are there. Right. They're walking the floor with their customers. Our growth solutions team is there.

09:03
Tim Dornfeld
And for those who aren't familiar with our growth solutions team does is they're kind of like my counterpart on sort of the category side where as category managers, we're the supplier facing wing of Kehi, right. We're going to work hand in hand with our suppliers to help them grow. Our Grow Solutions team are going to be interfacing directly with the retailers and they do a lot of work around category reviews, item recommendations, just helping to, you know, build out a strong category and make recommendations within our retail partners. So there's the opportunity to meet those folks as well, because that's another opportunity to get in front of a retailer in addition to your category manager, your sales team, in our sales team.

09:41
Daniel Scharff
Okay, that makes more sense to me now because that's the group that was taking meetings with people at our booth at Fancy Foods. And now I understand why all those big opportunities came up.

09:49
Tim Dornfeld
100% is, yeah, they can have those meetings with you, turn around the next week, send a recap directly to the retail buyers that they're working with and they can make things happen. So in one, it's a great networking event too. It is a selling show. We sell a ton of product and we've even kind of changed up the way that brands and retailers are able to kind of negotiate and sell you. Back in the old days, right, you had two days, you had to get all your orders in, get all your selling done on those two days. And I think what would happen is a lot of buyers, they would go and they'd hit their big brands, they work out all their show deals and that's what they had time for.

10:18
Tim Dornfeld
What we've now done is we allow people to place orders and kind of counter orders a week before the show and several days after the show. And I think what the Effect that has had is now if I'm a buyer, right, I know that with my big brands that I meet with constantly, like I can work out those sales deals either before the show or when I get back. And now as I'm walking the floor, I can actually really spend my time trying to find innovation or find foraging. And so I think that is a big boom to the younger brands that are there. Right. And so if you're a smaller brand, maybe you don't have a ton of distribution at this point. The show is a great opportunity to just expand your awareness within the KU organization.

10:54
Tim Dornfeld
Plus, you know what, they're a lot of fun. That's the other thing too. Right. We got great events, we've got pavilions, we've got activations, we have retail ready selling solutions, whether it be the shipper showcase, the fresh marketplace, like our chilled fine sections, things of that nature. So lots of ways to help really move a lot of product, hopefully drive incremental sales, you know, over the baseline.

11:16
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, that makes sense. The last one that I went to, actually I've only been to one, so the first one that I went to pretty early on in a brand journey and I was able to get two nice kind of one time buys and then I was able to have a first real conversation with a very substantial retailer that I was then later able to get into the full reset and maybe one or two more of those conversations that really started moving the ball along because the buyers are there and it's not a crazy show like expo where they have a million booths that they have to hit and yeah, the account managers are walking around with them. So I really liked it. And so why do you think everyone said this year it was just cracking?

11:52
Daniel Scharff
Did you see it just same as usual or did you think it was even more special, more people?

11:57
Tim Dornfeld
So I definitely think people enjoy going to Phoenix in early February, so that certainly helped. But yeah, I mean I think it's a combination of our category management team does a great job of curating the brands that we want to be at the show. Again, it's a mix of established brands, volume drivers, innovation, different categories, different sections of the store. Right. So that's appealing to the buyers that are walking around at the same time. You know, we had, you know, the Sprouts team was there, we had a number of different retailers there, all sorts of independents there that are placing orders, buying, having those conversations that you're talking about. So if you think about what you're trying to do with the show and you know, maximize people's time if they're leaving their office or their store to be there.

12:38
Tim Dornfeld
Like they want to interact, they want to have conversations, they want to write orders. And the fact that this show kind of facilitates that I think just makes people really happy. And so again, the feedback and the vibes from the show are just phenomenal.

12:50
Daniel Scharff
That's amazing. So any big trends you are seeing this year? I mean, yeah, we are just about to head to Expo. So I like, I know protein ification of everything is on everybody's list.

13:01
Tim Dornfeld
Definitely give you one of all I was going to mention.

13:02
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, because I mean you oversee a bunch of different categories. What kind of stuff are you seeing?

13:07
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, so we're definitely seeing a lot protein in everything. Right. I think, you know, with some of the different GPL1 drugs that are out, there's that focus on getting protein in the diet. So we're seeing that move to a lot of different categories. The continued expansion of Non Elk and other drink alternatives, that continues to be a big trend. We had our, you know, Non Elk Pavilion which really highlighted the different brands that are either providing alcohol alternatives or mocktails or different things of that nature. I think we're also continuing to see that there's a real expansion of, you know, I have to think of like world flavors or international flavors, whether it be different cuisines or even again some of the more traditional flavors from outside the US like moving into different products that are here as well.

13:52
Tim Dornfeld
So those are three trends that I definitely have not only seen at our show but you know, seen across the industry. I'm sure we'll see plenty of it at Expo west coming up. They all kind of work together because in a lot of ways again it is around that total better health, right. Being healthier lifestyles, all of that sort of thing.

14:08
Daniel Scharff
How does KHI respond to when there's these like, you know, protein stuff like that or plant based a few years ago? Like are you guys generally just trying to see what the retailers want, make sure you have good solutions there or do you look at a higher level view of the whole thing? Like yes, some of these things will be trends, some of them are fads. And you know, we have, we've been around long enough to kind of know how quickly we should ramp up in different areas. How do you look at the rapid scaling in different claims or ingredients?

14:37
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, I mean that's where having just like a team of like really intelligent, passionate category managers come in handy. Right. And a lot of them have A ton of experience. Even if you look at where our category managers come from, like some have come directly from the supplier side. We have folks that have come from retailer, right. We've got a really diverse background in our category management team. So they, I think they do a really good job of understanding. To your point, what's the difference between a fad, a trend or what might be the kind of the next institution, right, we are constantly looking for is one. It's a balancing act, right? So like there's a lot of art that goes with the science with this, but we definitely want to be on trend.

15:14
Tim Dornfeld
We also want to be out ahead of the trends and predicting what's next. The other thing that I think we also try to do too though is still provide like what is maybe weeding through some of the noise is the way to kind of speak to it, right, Is we're not going to bring in every brand that is on trend, right? At some point you hit like a saturation. So that's part of what our category managers are doing too is like, okay, right now, right, Everything is protein. We could just add brands that are just saying, hey, we've added protein to it. What is unique about the brands that we're bringing on, right? Is it a unique value proposition? Is it a formulation that we haven't seen before?

15:51
Tim Dornfeld
Is it packaging that you just can't miss and you know it's going to be a hit, right? There's all those things that we take into account. So that way, because what. When we talk to like our retail partners, right, what do they want? They want innovation and they want stuff that's going to turn on the shelf, right? And so our job as the category team is to look through all that's out there and try to find those brands that we think are going to really satisfy those things. Because at the end of the day, all we're trying to do is get product off of our truck, out of the back room, on the shelf and into the consumer's basket.

16:22
Daniel Scharff
So is it fair to say then what retailers look to Cahi for is just that it's innovation and high performing products and brands?

16:30
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, absolutely. And I think that we have continued to involve some of our partnerships with our retail cars, right? It's making sure our category managers and their category managers are talking more and trying to understand. All right, Mr. Retailer, what are you trying to do with your set in this category? And here's what I'm seeing out here that will kind of fit that for you. And I think that if we can continue to find the brands that are innovative, that are cutting edge, then, you know, it helps to like allow brands to continue to grow. It gives them that platform that then allow some of these innovations or these trends to grow and become sustainable. Right. We don't want to just find one brand that's on trend and try to make that work. Right. You need three to four solid brands.

17:11
Tim Dornfeld
So now you've got a set, you've got a section, you can catch the consumer's eye. And so I think that, yeah, absolutely, retailers are looking for us to be the ones to go out those, find those brands, get them on board so that way we can ship them to their stores.

17:24
Daniel Scharff
Okay, and so what is Khe's role to make sure that the brands actually do well on shelf with those retailers?

17:31
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, so I mean, I think what we can do is we can help to kind of consult. I've always felt like the category management role as much as we're, you know, supplier facing and innovating, there's a lot of like education and consultation that we do with especially newer and emerging brands. Right. So it's helping them to understand, especially if they're new to retail, like what is sort of expected of them, what promotions should you be running? You know, how many SKUs should you have more meeting with them and vetting them? Like if we think that there issues with packaging, we'll give them thoughts on, you know, hey, I would tweak this, maybe make your logo bigger or it's. I know you're, you've got a 24 pack, but most retailers are going to want your product right now in a six pack.

18:10
Tim Dornfeld
Like it's little things like that we can help to advise the brands on before they get to the retailer. I do think that there is some of that where the retailers would like. The fact that we are able to help advise these brands, make them a little bit more retail ready, especially the new and emerging brands that haven't necessarily gone through the retail space.

18:30
Daniel Scharff
Tim, I think the time is nigh for actually us to get a good intro from you because we just kind of jumped right in here. So can you tell everybody where did you come from? What is all of the stuff that you actually do at Kahe?

18:41
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, yeah, not a problem. So I currently am a director of category management here at Kahe. I manage, I'm one of two directors on our team. Between us, we manage 20 category managers. And so, you know, my job is really to help kind of set the Goals and the vision for the team and just support our category managers in any way that I can. There's a lot of like internal projects and things that I work on and things like that to help make us a better organization and better category management team prior to moving into the director's role. So I've been with Kahi since 2019 and I came on board to help as a category manager over pet food, household cleaners, general merchandise.

19:18
Tim Dornfeld
The reason that they brought me up from that is before coming to K, he actually worked Nestle Prenik pet care for 11 years. So I was did everything from retail rep, shelf and category analysts. And then I was actually an account manager for them, calling on different pet distributors and like the Farm and feed channel and things of that nature. So when I came on board to Kahey, it was at a time when Kahey was really looking to kind of turn into pet and start to grow that category out. So I came on board to help sort of jumpstart that. So as a category manager I managed those categories for a couple of years. I then moved into the senior category manager role where I managed shelf stable beverages. That where you and I started working together in your past life.

19:55
Tim Dornfeld
So manage the beverage desk for a couple years before moving here into the director's role. It's been a great run. Like I said, I. I love the CPG world. It's the biggest small world out there, right? You know, everybody, nobody leaves, everybody just ends up at potentially a different booth at a show. And it's just great to always see the same folks. And even at the last KI show ran into somebody that I was doing resets at pet supplies plus 12 years ago and now he's one of our suppliers and it's just such a great industry to be a part of. And I've loved my almost 15 plus years in the industry.

20:25
Daniel Scharff
I like to hear you say it that way of just like we're all going to be in this for life. We'll be at different companies, you know, whatever. But like, yeah, it's true. It's good to remember. This is our crew, our lifetime industry crew. So Tim, so I know you have been a category manager over a bunch of different categories, right? You've worked on nutrition bars, beverage, pet, general merchandise. How is it different for brands? Like what are some of the differences between brands or expectations or just performance across some of those categories? Anything that would be pretty interesting for people to learn about some of the big differences across those categories for let's say an entrepreneur just thinking about being in one of them.

21:01
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah. You know, like I think one of the interesting things about let me start with like pet food. Right. So here at Kahi we are used to being like the innovation, the launch site, right. We're where people come first. And if you look at the pet landscape, there's an entire kind of other group there, that pet specialty world, right. Where the independent pet stores, the pet supplies, the pack, right. That's where a lot of the innovation starts there. Right. And so but a lot of times by the time they get to grocery, they've expanded, they've already grown. It's a little different than the lifecycle here where we're grabbing small brands in the CPG world in a lot of other categories and helping to build them up from ground up.

21:35
Tim Dornfeld
So like that was kind of an interesting thing especially because I had always worked in the pet specialty side, right. I was used to everybody coming to us first. Whereas here it kind of, they were more mature when they got here. Here it's also, it's interesting I think just like again the different roles some of these brands play in the store as well. Right. So things like household cleaners, pet gentle merch, like those are things that are like kind of added on. Like that's not what's driving people necessarily into a grocery store. Right. But as I'm managing things like beverages well that 100 is a trip driver to the grocery world. Something like bars can be or can just be like a high turn or a high impulse buy. Right.

22:11
Tim Dornfeld
So I think it's really important to your point for what founders to really understand like when you're creating a product like where does that product fit in the landscape? How are retailers using it? Right. And so am I a trip driver? Am I like a high margin like add on like expand the basket product? Am I something that's an everyday staple? Am I more of a tried and true like all of those things because that should help you create your strategy for whether it be how you promote what your packaging looks like, what off shelf merchandising that you offer all of those things. Again, every category is a little bit different. So I would definitely say either get talk to your category manager when you come on board with Kahi about hey, what do you see in this category? What makes us successful?

22:54
Tim Dornfeld
Or talk to folks within the CPG startup network and different things like that, like really understand the category that you're playing in because it is different from each category.

23:03
Daniel Scharff
That's so interesting to hear you say that. I and especially about The Pet Channel. And so you're saying very early brands, probably they're gonna work a lot more on indie stores and indie chains. Now is that just because that's like. Yeah, I mean I have a dog. I don't go to a big chain. I just go to the thing that's near me. And it's probably there are a lot of high quality ones. There always have been wherever I lived. And they're gonna be the ones recommending products to me. Is it because of that fragmentation? Like you just don't have the same kind of like top five, top 10 grocery stores where we all shop, even the ultra wealthy down to like you just go to the good options near you.

23:38
Tim Dornfeld
Don't get me wrong, like still a petsmart, a Petco, things like that, they can still launch innovation, but I'm talking more like your traditional grocers. Right? So. And it's just, it's a space thing, right? Like that's all petsmart, Petco, small boutique, you know, the independent, that's pretty much what they do is pet food. So they've got all that space versus you go to your most grocery retailers and you know, maybe they have 24, 32, you know, maybe 48ft to get the entire section in there. Whereas some of these pet chains will give 48ft to one brand. You know, so it's just like, it's just a little bit of a different landscape. And I think that there's still opportunities 100% for PET because again, people are still shopping there.

24:15
Tim Dornfeld
You could absolutely capture that trip, but just is just kind of a little bit of a different mindset. Takes a little longer to get in there with the grocery stores here.

24:24
Daniel Scharff
That's so interesting to me. Okay, so there are a bunch of questions I need to ask you because all the brands will not forgive me if I don't. Which, okay, first off is, let's say I'm just starting out. Like when should I try to talk to Katie? How far along should I be? How early is too early? What's the right time and the kind of right way to do it?

24:42
Tim Dornfeld
You know, again, if you are at the point where it's maybe you and your brother in law are still making the product out of the garage and you're just shipping everything dtc, right. It might be a little too early. Right. But I think if you've gotten to the point where you're starting to build out an organization, you're starting to maybe get a sales group going, you've got your co packer set up, you've got some level of operations like I think that's when you could start to have the conversations with K. No mistake. We want to learn about brands even before they're ready to come on board with us.

25:11
Tim Dornfeld
And one thing I want to stress to all the new brands that are out there is if you talk to your K category manager and the category manager just says, hey listen, now is not the right time because I feel like you need to do this, this or this. Please don't take that as a closed door. That is not the case. Right. Because we are a national distributor, there is a bit of like a responsibility on us as far as who we bring in. Right. Too early, too soon can be damaging to brands and that's something that our category team takes very seriously as their vetting brand.

25:42
Tim Dornfeld
So again we're not saying that your brand is not good or could never get into khi, but we have the experience and have seen enough of what's gone right, what's gone wrong, what's gone sideways to help guide you into this is what I would be thinking about before you come on board and if you take that at kind of face value, go back and look into making some of those changes and then maybe six months from now you come back to us, the time might be right or you might have done those things or maybe now a retailer wants to bring you on board and there's a better opportunity.

26:09
Tim Dornfeld
So it's kind of a long way of saying is like I don't know there's necessarily time to be too early but just kind of manage your expectations on like where you are, the life cycle of whether or not you're getting into a national distributor.

26:20
Daniel Scharff
It's hard to say because I definitely have managed to make a good impression with people before. I even had shelf ready packaging with just a couple like some good slides. But it was, we had enough, it was compelling at that point. I've also witnessed firsthand brands kind of blow up when their first shot, their first chance to make a good impression by I don't know, showing up with like a plastic baggie with product in it and being like, could you taste this and tell me what you think of it right now just being a little over eager. So I don't know, I think like enough to make a good impression. What do you think?

26:50
Tim Dornfeld
I mean you have to have a brand right to your point. If you just have a baggie of product and we do get those from time to time, like that is not it right. You need to have a package and a plan, you know, before there's a serious opportunity to come within K. Right. So like I think yeah, there is that middle ground between like great idea and finished product. As far as like a brand that's ready to expand nationally. There is a time in between where we could start having that conversation.

27:16
Daniel Scharff
Yes. I mean a non negotiable for Kahee is going to be messing up any kind of product. Like you guys don't do that. Just like you don't want them wondering if you're the kind of person who's going to have a professional finished product that they can pick up and deliver to their customers.

27:29
Tim Dornfeld
Absolutely.

27:30
Daniel Scharff
Okay, so. And how can people talk to you? I mean I know you guys are at events obviously all the time, really excited to see a bunch of you at Expo for example, but how are most people getting on your team's radar?

27:43
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, so I mean I, it's, you know, we as category managers we're using range me to go out there and look for brands. So if you're on range me you could ping your category manager or there's a good chance we'll find you. We're definitely walking around shows or doing different events. Like I don't think we're that hard to find. Right. I'm sure putting something out there in the, you know, startup CPG where like who's the category manager over this? You're going to find out. Right. So we're definitely available and ready to be spoken to and want to learn about your brand. There's also we run, you know, four times a year we run our trend finder event. Right.

28:13
Tim Dornfeld
And this is an opportunity for new and emerging brands to sign up through range be to be a part of our trend finder event where you'll get that one one meeting with a category manager to pitch your brand. And if we find that there's a brand that we think is ready to go and we want to bring it on, we'll give them the golden ticket and bring them on board as one of our golden ticket winners. And even if we don't. And again it kind of goes back to what I just talked about. That last question is even if we don't bring you on, like take the feedback that you get from your category manager to heart. I can tell you from the years of doing this, I have met with a number of brands at a trend finder.

28:45
Tim Dornfeld
They weren't ready then six, nine months, maybe a year later we brought them on board and they're within k Right. So again, no is not no forever. It just always kind of might just be no for right now. Do a couple of these things and then let's reconvene.

28:58
Daniel Scharff
Okay. So because on your website you can submit as a supplier and that takes you to range me. So that's where you would. That's like kind of the formal process. And then you can also probably look for other ways to network with your category manager, whether it's at trade shows or try to hit them up in a friendly, subtle way on LinkedIn.

29:17
Tim Dornfeld
And there are brokers out there that can help make those introductions. There are people that are out there that do like fractional sales or run sales management that have, you know, relationships with the category managers. And kind of what's nice sometimes about going with either a broker or someone like that too is they understand like what category managers kind of look for. Like they can. To your point, Daniel, when you talk about, you know, making that good first impression, like they can kind of help sand down some of the edges or like, hey, this is what they're going to be looking for. This is what I'd be talking about. So that way when you do have that meeting, you're kind of even that next step ahead there as far as moving forward.

29:48
Daniel Scharff
Yeah, for me, I just was out there doing my thing and somebody was like, I think actually KHI would be really interested in this product. You want me to make an introduction? And there's someone there who's really nice. And that's how I met Cas initially made a nice relationship with her. And then at my very first expo, I won a golden ticket.

30:04
Tim Dornfeld
There you go. Yeah, there you go. There's a real life success story right there.

30:07
Daniel Scharff
It was, it was so good. I didn't even know what it was, but we definitely made it like it was the biggest deal of anything that had ever happened, which it was a big deal. I mean, it was.

30:16
Tim Dornfeld
That is so much fun, like going around an expo and handing out a golden ticket or, you know, all those. It is truly one of the fun parts of our job is by just being able to hand that over and seeing the reaction and just the excitement of it all. It's. Yeah, it's really cool.

30:30
Daniel Scharff
It's the best. It was about 20 minutes before that made its way onto my LinkedIn in a big cheesy photo, which I really recommend to people. If you can get a moment at the trade show and post it at the show, it can get tons of impressions, like, remind some buyers to come by Your booth. That was super helpful for us. That was. I really appreciated that you guys did that there. Okay, so if you're trying to then figure out who the manager is, that info is kind of out there. Somebody might even look at our alley rally list of VIPs because the whole KE category management team is going to be there. So they could go back and just take a look, see and it links to their linkedins. So then, okay, you're getting going with KHE for the golden ticket.

31:09
Daniel Scharff
I think what that let us do was actually open up maybe two strategic distribution centers for us where were really going to focus. But how does it usually go? Are you guys going to be starting with the brand? Like, okay, they may be coming with anchor account, right. Which means it's one of those bigger accounts that you guys work with where if they want the product, you will open up a distribution center for them. Or maybe there are a couple distribution centers that would be accounts like Sprouts that can do that or some more regional chains that just have a good number of stores that can support the volume. Right.

31:38
Daniel Scharff
But for other brands that you like, that don't come with that, are you typically going to say, okay, yeah, let's like get you one DC and see how it goes or how does that conversation usually go?

31:48
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, that's a great question because yeah, the anchor account is usually probably the easiest way to get in. Right. And that's kind of the tried and true way. But yeah, there are a number of brands where again, the KHE category manager identifies this brand is like, I think you're ready, I'm excited about. So there's a few different ways you can come to market. So one is you're really truly like on trend innovative and something that the category manager is really excited about. You know, we may bring into our Elevate program. Right. And so KE Elevate is two year High Touch high awareness program to really help accelerate those brands that we think are like kind of the next game changer within the different categories. And so with that, we're going to launch it through new Akehi Executions.

32:27
Tim Dornfeld
There's going to be a number of like ways that we're going to promote your brand through, like whether it be our socials, our advertising, the show, you got the big KE Elevate logo in front of your booth, like different things like that. So. And what's also nice about that is when I go back to that High Touch, right, You're going to be having meetings with your category manager starting out weekly. Right. But you know, they'll kind of stretch out as you grow and expand. But just a great opportunity to really grow those exciting brands you'd asked about. Hey, how do I maybe come into one or two DCs like for the golden ticket, for example, the big win there is you actually get to run your new AK execution and we'll cover kind of the entrance fee for that. Right?

33:02
Tim Dornfeld
So if you're not paying the $350 to do new AK is part of the golden ticket winner, you can definitely utilize new Acehi to open those. When you talk about maybe someone's coming in and meet with your category manager, like hey listen, we got the Northeast and we got Texas, right? Whatever that brand has, maybe a small broker they're working up there like some regional salespeople. Even just a collection of stores that would work in some of those DCs. Like you can work with your category manager when you come into Kahe. Very rarely if ever is somebody going into 16 DCs on day one, right? That is not the way that we do it.

33:34
Tim Dornfeld
Most of the time it's two to three DCs and it's really what can you support as a brand and that could even include like expanding out on top of like your anchor account. Because what we want to make sure is if we run the new @KHI program for you after you get those initial sales into the independence and I'll just quickly for those not familiar with New Acahy, right. It's a two month program to open a DC and sell your product at a discount to independent customers within that dc. And what's critical to that is you can get the sales there and you know the month one month two with the discounts.

34:06
Tim Dornfeld
The brands that are really successful then have a way to then follow up with those accounts that but to make sure that you're staying on shelf to make sure that they're reordering. So when your category manager is meeting with you to talk about hey, where do we want to launch new ak? It's really important that you've got the support there to make sure that's fully successful. One other quick program I just want to highlight when we talk about like helping out new emerging brands is our administrative allowance program that we just a couple months ago. So that is for brands that are within KHE for their first year. And what it is it's a 2% off invoice allowance that runs through that first year.

34:41
Tim Dornfeld
But what it does is it opts you out of some of the KHI charges that a lot of new brands face, whether it be intro allowances when going into a DC category, into a DC MCB fees or extra performance fees on manual chargebacks or charges that are coming back from retailers, things of that nature there. And the idea behind that is one of the things that one of the most challenging things for new and emerging brands is that cost uncertainty, right? Not being able like getting hit with those first, you know your POS come in those first POS and you're expecting this much to come in. But then these new fees hit you, right? And all of a sudden you're scrambling for cash flow and things like that.

35:18
Tim Dornfeld
So what's great about this is you can basically plan out for that first year, okay, we're going to pay 2% per invoice. You can work that into your budget. And we just feel and the feedback that we've gotten is that's going to be really helpful for new and emerging brands rather than kind of dealing with like the ups and downs as things are coming through. Again, if there's slotting fees or free fills, you're still going to be build back for those. But some of the different fees and add ons that go on top of that are going to be waived in lieu of that 2%.

35:47
Daniel Scharff
Okay, that's cool to know about. So let's say I'm opening up a DC or two and yeah, it's not like you're just going to open up the DC and then people are just going to start ordering a bun. Okay, Hope maybe you did the new AT KHI program which gives them the indies an incentive to try out your product. But also everybody should have a plan, right? Like you need to actually go and get to those stores or the anchor accounts in those areas somehow, right? Because you need, I think for me the number I remember is like you want about 40 stores pulling your 40 doors, pulling your product per DC at least.

36:19
Tim Dornfeld
So we will open a DC for a new supplier if you've got 20 points of distribution. So if you're a new supplier or one of our best suppliers, it's 20. But again the more obviously points of distribution that you have, that's more people ordering that helps you get to minimums. And that's another thing to take into account too is like even order minimums, like if we're coming and picking up your product right there, the difference in hitting like the 250 pound minimum for a water brand is very different than a bar brand, right. We can get £250 of water, that's easy. But if you think about like from a nutrition bar, right, Think about how many bars you got to stack on a pallet to get to that minimum.

36:54
Tim Dornfeld
So that's another thing like we start talking about like category specific things that you need to be thinking about is like even just the weight of your product can sometimes present a challenge. So sometimes when people are like, well, I've got, you know, these 10 stores, like is that enough? And they're kind of, you know, maybe get frustrated why we don't open it up. It's again, it's not because we're trying to be it hinder your brand or make it hard for you. It's kind of trying to get out ahead of some of those issues you might find down the road about being able to reorder and hitting minimums and even just, you know, profitable growth and things like that.

37:22
Daniel Scharff
Okay, so that makes a lot of sense. And then so yeah, if I'm doing that, I'm thinking about supporting the brand. So I should maybe think about Muakehi. I should have some kind of a promo plan in mind also that I need to budget for any other things that you think I should have in my budget or game plan to make sure that I perform well on those early DCs.

37:42
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, for sure. I mean, I think the other thing to keep in account, keep in mind as a supplier is you're going to have, there's going to be things where you're supporting khi, right. So that could be the new Akhi, that could be your promotional plan. But then there's also like the stuff that you to support the retailers. Right. So those retailers also have their own programs. Now the brands that you know are really kind of savvy, right. When they put together their KHI roadmap promotional plan for a year. Right. And let's say they're running 4 off invoice. What they'll try to do is then tie in the promotions that they're wanting with their retailers so that they can kind of layer those over top of their Kahe promotions. So that way you're being more efficient that way.

38:21
Tim Dornfeld
But I think that you really do have to be thinking about like there's a lot of different places that you're going to have to support and a lot of those billbacks and things are going to come back to you via the distributor. Right. Kind of one of the services we provide our retailers is getting the billbacks from them and then passing them to the Suppliers as well. So sometimes it can look like man, the distributor is just killing us, but it's coming from a lot of different areas. And so when you think about your total plan, again we always think of it holistically. Think about all the different places that you're going to have to support when you're going to marketplace.

38:53
Tim Dornfeld
And really you probably want to have 40 to 50 points of margin kind of built into your product there to be able to support all these different things and be able to expand profitably.

39:01
Daniel Scharff
That makes sense. So. And yeah, you talked earlier about the first year administrative allowance also any other tips for how brands should try to set themselves up for financial health while they grow. And obviously they need to account for the whole supply chain.

39:16
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah. So first and foremost, again, understand what you're agreeing to, whether it be with your distributor partner, with your retail partners, understand the different fee structures, the different costs that are involved, like the cost to serve. And again it's not just the KD fees or potential fines, also the retailer stuff as well and kind of game out those scenarios. Right. Like if I know retailer act is going to want to two cases per store and I'm going to go into two, like I better know what that's going to potentially cost me. And also, and if I've read like the KHE policy procedure agreement, I know that could pass through us. That's going to be passed through at wholesale versus cost. So that's going to be, I have to factor that in to my budget, things like that.

39:56
Tim Dornfeld
You know, understanding that, you know, here at Kahi we're going to provide you all the data you need to manage your business through our KHE Connect BI program. Right. So you're going to have your sales data, your inventory data, your financial data. But to support that there's also a 2% off invoice that allows you to have access to it. So it's like just knowing everything. So that way you can budget that in as you're working and then that will help you kind of from a financial standpoint. And just the other thing I would say is you got to stay on top of it as well. Right. We have our program case all which will house all your deductions for it.

40:26
Tim Dornfeld
You've got to be in there regularly as well, reviewing those, understanding kind of what's coming through and just really being on top of it. I think for people to really be successful as Kate, you almost have to treat your relationship with your distributor like as at the same level of care that you do with that anchor account that you're working with. Because there's a lot of things that are running through us that are going to potentially affect your bottom line just as a cost to serve piece. And so the brands that I think run into trouble are the ones that aren't staying on top of that. And then some, you know, all of a sudden things start to add up and that's when the panic sets in.

40:57
Daniel Scharff
Makes sense. Okay, cool. So let's go back to this hypothetical where Tim starts his own brand, knowing what you know all about. All of the good programs that you could choose from a Khi. First of all, like, what would your top couple things you'd want to remember coming in about how to approach and work with Khe and then what are the specific marketing programs you'd be like, I would definitely do these three ones or whatever my first year to really catapult my brand.

41:23
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah. So I think again, there's not going to be a one size fits. All right. So like that's, I think the biggest thing is like what works for one brand may not be the right path for another brand. So I think you have to take into account, as we talked about your category, your product and all of that. I think that what you want to make sure that you're doing is you're looking to expand. Like, where can I expand at a rate that I can kind of stair step and grow. Right. So I'm not getting out over my skis like too much too soon. Absolutely happens and can be damaging to brand. So sometimes it's avoidable, other times it's not. But be thinking about that. Where do I want to go? Like, at what level can I scale?

41:58
Tim Dornfeld
And with that's where again, for the new Akhi, when you're coming on board. Right. Instead of maybe putting your product in all seven of our independent DCs, maybe you start with three because that's what you have the bandwidth to cover and really support and grow. And you're going to kind of take it maybe region by region or D.C. By D.C. Looking at, you know, the Kahe landscape is going after sprouts early in the game. Is that the right route? Or, you know, is there maybe a group of infra accounts that are decent size and can kind of allow you to grow at your pace? I highly recommend that in that first year you do get with your category manager, put together a roadmap plan for the next year. We talk to it, we call it roadmapping.

42:37
Tim Dornfeld
It's your Promotional planning for the next year, plan to run those four off invoices, plan to put ads on top of it. And one of the great things about being a new supplier is if you commit to $10,000 in ads with us, we're going to give you a 50% discount, right? So you can really get a good bang for your buck and an roi. The idea behind offering that discount is, hey, we want you to promote with us. We want you to try something, see how it works. We want to build awareness of your brand within ke's network. The other reason I always really encourage brands to promote with us is think about it from either a buyer standpoint or like the KHE territory manager standpoint point.

43:12
Tim Dornfeld
If they go in and pitch your brand to a retailer, what's one of the things they're going to ask, like what is the promotional plan this brand has? Right? And if the brand doesn't have a promotional plan, it's going to be harder to get in that retailer, Right? But if you say, oh yeah, they got a quarterly promo with us, they're running a feature deal, which is our most popular ad that our independents love, right? It helps the retailer get to. Yes, but again, one of the great things about our category team is they're going to work with you to have the right plan, right? We've all as category managers been there where someone comes in with just this. They have bought every ad imaginable, right? Hey, it may look great for my number, but it's not the right thing for the brand.

43:46
Tim Dornfeld
And so we'll get back to them, say, hold on, let's scale that back. Like, what are you trying to do there with that? The other thing I'll just talk quickly about from like some of our promotional opportunities too is as we look at the changing landscape out there, we've also evolved the way that we go to market with our promotions. So now rather than, you know, it used to be, we'd send you the giant phone book, right? With all the promos in there. We've tried to become more digital, right? Because more and more people are working within the KHE enterprise marketplace. So the feature deal is still our top performing ad.

44:13
Tim Dornfeld
But what we're trying to tell folks is now that we have like different digital options, whether it be sponsored, search, connect, banner ads, is layer things on top of those feature deals, right? Have a more holistic approach, right? So you're building awareness to your ad, right? And if your ad is strong, then you're going to get stronger performance on the off invoice that you provided, right? It's all kind of that cascading down to really drive performance, ROI sales, new points of distribution.

44:38
Daniel Scharff
All right, I mean, gosh, it just sounds like Google strategy or Amazon search strategy, all of that stuff. So that makes a lot of sense. And then so Tim, one thing that Kahi does, which is really cool is in Kahe Connect you can actually get a full list of all of the account managers, their emails. I probably was a little over eager when I got access to that list. I think I emailed all of them in the early stages of my brand. Like mine's the best brand. Can't you all take it? And I think my sales guy was like, whoa, you were like emailing even the janitor? Or they're like, you pretty much blanketed everybody, dude. So is that not the right approach or how would you recommend brands use that list that's out there?

45:15
Tim Dornfeld
So yeah, so what you're referring to is our navigating K file and any new brand or brand that if you have not used the Navigating KHI file, you're missing out. Like that is your instructional guide to how to use K. Because in addition to like our regions, our DCs, our people, like there's a lot of great information on there about, you know, everything from like gtins and how to set those up to how to manage some of your financial stuff. How do we pass through promotion, like it's the one stop shop. So if there's one thing you take away from here and you're coming to K, use Navigating Khe. Now the way that Daniel maybe used it originally may have been a little over eager.

45:49
Tim Dornfeld
Here's the way that I always recommend to brands is when you're reaching out to our sales team, think like a salesperson, right? What is going to motivate them? Every email they get tells them that they have the greatest brand that they have ever seen. Right? But if I'm a salesperson, like what makes me unique, you know, for the brand? If I'm reaching out to the salesperson, what makes me unique? What promotions do I have? You know, it could even be as simple as hey, I have brand X I play in this space. Can you tell me when your retailer is doing their next round of, you know, resets around that or what are they doing their next review on that? Because one thing I think that sometimes will happen is people will send an email and they don't hear back from our sales team.

46:27
Tim Dornfeld
But you know, the sales team may have just Done their review on that a month ago and it's not coming up for another 11 months. Right. And they're managing so much stuff that they want to get back to everybody, but it's just not always feasible. So what I say is be concise to the point, but also have like a cadence. Right. So if you don't hear from somebody back on your first email them in two, three months. Right. And just say, hey, just wanted to follow up. Want to see when the next review is going to be. It shows a combination of persistence without driving them crazy.

46:54
Daniel Scharff
I really like how you're putting that. And like at shows, I feel like some buyers, it's going to be hard if you try to overwhelm them, like, hello, I'm Daniel and here's all about my product and can you just stop for a while and really try it and tell me that you like it and all this stuff. Whereas if I actually just want to meet them and have a relationship, if I just say like, hey, when's your review? They're going to tell me. That's a really easy thing for them to answer, either in person or over email. They're probably going to respond to that email. If it's a very easy one for them just to respond, knock it out of their inbox, no problem. Right. So that makes a lot of sense.

47:23
Daniel Scharff
I hope everybody took note of that because I think that's a great way to either engage or re engage with the sales team. Just to ask them a pretty simple question. I like that great one. And then I will say that I just remembered when I did the Cahi show often, I don't know, I'm always kind of like skeptical about different marketing options. When I see people like branding the escalator and stuff and like math, I was like, I don't know if that pays off. But I will say one that I did that I thought was pretty good was we got the all show email for the Kahi show, which is where I think they're only like, I don't know, three or five.

47:54
Daniel Scharff
I don't know how many slots for these, but it's yeah, basically like right at the beginning of the show, they will send an email to everybody about your brand. And so I jumped right on that. When I looked through the whole list, I was like, that one. I like emails. I know everybody opens an email. Not like they might be looking the wrong way on the escalator and miss your banner. And then we worked with them to make it the one that went out the Day before the show, and then a lot of people came by the booth of the show and they're like, did you guys sponsor this whole show? That's sort of what it looked like. Like, well, yes, we're a big deal. Yes, yes. A very established new brand. So I feel like we got good outsized impact from that one.

48:29
Daniel Scharff
So now maybe that option is going to sell out now that I've told everybody about it.

48:33
Tim Dornfeld
No, and that's great. And I think you hit on it, Daniel. Like, every brand, right. It's going to, like, different life cycles. Right. If you're a large brand with wear, like putting your name on. Yes. Maybe the right way to go because it's a reminder. Whereas if you're a new brand, like, you want to get eyeballs, right? You want to get those open. So, yeah, it all comes back to just having a plan and kind of knowing where you are, your life cycle in your category. And again, work with our marketing team, work with our category managers to get their advice on it. We're not going to steer you wrong.

48:59
Daniel Scharff
I know I say this now and then I hope to get to the point where the startup CBG brand is big enough that I'm just like, give me those eight escalators. We just want arrows all the way up.

49:08
Tim Dornfeld
All right.

49:08
Daniel Scharff
It's worth it.

49:09
Tim Dornfeld
There you go.

49:10
Daniel Scharff
I love it. All right, so, yeah, just last question. What are some roadblocks that you could have to grow with K here? What are, you know, some missteps that maybe a brand makes other than, let's say, trying to grow too fast, like open up too much and get a little too big for their britches or any other things that you would just, like, really want for brands to know just so they can have a nice, healthy growth.

49:32
Tim Dornfeld
With Kahi, yeah, I think we touched on, you know, a lot of it kind of throughout. But just to sort of summarize again, like, just make sure that when I'm talking to people or when I was having those conversations. And so anybody who's met with me has probably heard a bunch of these sound bites before. So I apologize. You're hearing it again. But, you know, I always say, like, when you're coming on to Kahi, right. Like, I would ask, like, are you ready to potentially go into an account like Sprouts tomorrow? Right. Because once you're in our network, they our growth solutions, he may present it to them, they may see it and they may want it. Right. And so I think sometimes, again, it's at that.

50:02
Tim Dornfeld
I think one of the roadblocks is again, people going in too soon, not having it kind of fleshed out, how they're going to get there or how they're going to support it. They look at the end game is getting into Khe when it really, that's the beginning. So I think the biggest roadblocks or hindrances that I've seen is just maybe just not quite being ready. Right? You want to get in, but then you don't maybe have the funds to run that promotional plan. You don't have the sales team to get out there and really push your brand. You know, you don't have to work with a broker to work with Kahi. But you know, one thing I will say for the brokers that are out there is they do work with us, they understand our system, they've seen what works with other folks, right?

50:38
Tim Dornfeld
So, you know, if you find the right broker that I would always say if you're talking about brokers, talk to a lot of them, right? Figure out who aligns with your company's values, who aligns with where you want to go. Do you just have the right feel for them? You know, all of that thing, again, you don't have to work with broker, but they certainly do help to help navigate a lot of what's going on here. So I think that's the biggest thing is just maybe not fully understanding what they're getting into and not having the infrastructure in place to truly support going with a national distributor like K. I.

51:08
Daniel Scharff
Think that's spot on and I think, you know, even broader. Just what is your overall brand strategy or business strategy? Where are you trying to grow this brand? With what kind of customers? Because Kehi can get you to those customers. But like, if you don't have that strategy going in and understand like, okay, how much money do I have at this stage of the business? How am I going to use it? What am I trying to get done then? I mean, you just won't know how to evaluate the opportunities that come up. And doing each of those in isolation is hard to do because I mean, when you're getting into a new retailer, there's going to be slotting that they charge you and all these fees.

51:43
Daniel Scharff
And I would say, number one, I love when brands really have a full P and L built out for each one of those opportunities. Understanding the distributor costs, the retailer costs like the likely velocity when they're going to get paid back, putting their cogs into it, that's a great way to look at every opportunity. But just having thought ahead of time of like, yeah, what is going to fit with my strategy to grow this brand the way that the brand is intended, the kind of customers and consumers that I'm trying to reach. And so that kind of a strategy, I think, is the one you need so that when yes Sprouts comes calling and you're just in a couple of DCs, you know how to evaluate that innovation set opportunity.

52:18
Daniel Scharff
Does this get me closer to my goal, or is it just going to be a distraction for the company and the precious funds that we have available to deploy and that. I think the easy part is telling brands they need to do this to have a strategy. The tough part is really doing it when you're an early brand, because if you haven't done this before, it is incredibly difficult. But there are a lot of tools. I think this podcast is one because if you scroll back in history, you'll see a lot of really smart people on here talking about their strategies. I think a second one is just the resources that we have available. And so one that we've built is the full retail sales tracker.

52:54
Daniel Scharff
So if you go to the startup CBG website under Founder Resources, there's a retail sales tracker, and it actually shows you every single chain around the country. And do they pull from Kahi and which Kahedc is it? So that you could use that to start making your plan at the beginning? Like, okay, yeah, maybe my strategy is going to be a regional one and I'm going to focus here. And, oh, if I can open up this KHI dc, here are all the accounts that actually pull from it. Let me go blanket those and find the right broker who just crushes it. There's. What do you think, Tim? Am I on the right track?

53:22
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I think that we treat working with a distributor like every other part of your business, right? Be intentional, know what you're going to do, have a plan, and then go out and execute that plan. And I think you. You hit on it. Right? One of the things that I love about being in the CPG world is it. It's collaborative. Like even brands, even though they're technically competing against each other. And I'm sure you see this even more than I do within the community that you work. Like, founders are willing to help other founders, right? They'll have those conversations. They'll talk about some of the pitfalls that they. That they've gone through. There's a lot of people who have been in the industry for a long time.

53:54
Tim Dornfeld
They've seen a lot of things that they'll come and, you know, partner with you or, you know, again, maybe come and be your fractional VP of sales and help you navigate some stuff. So, yeah, just talk to people, ask questions, talk to your category manager. Again, I keep going back to that as well. But you know, our folks have seen a lot of things and what works and what doesn't, and we're all invested in the success of your brand. So again, we want to see you grow and expand and do well. So ask us what we see and ask our advice, you know, and it may work for you, it may not, but we're always going to try to point you in the right direction for sure.

54:24
Daniel Scharff
I love it and thank you for all the advice that you've just given all of us today on this podcast. I'm sure it's going to find its way into the ears of so many brands who are launching and trying to figure out this very tough game that we all love to play. Right? It is a complicated one, but we wouldn't have it any other way. So, Tim, thank you again. I really appreciate all of the knowledge that you're dropping here today. Kahi is just such an important part of our overall ecosystem and helping figure out a way for all of us to accomplish our dreams of getting our brands out there into the world, into all these stores. You know, we can't do it without you guys. So thank you again and I'm very excited to see you in person quite soon.

55:04
Tim Dornfeld
Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much for the time today and really appreciate the partnership and allowing to come on here and hopefully help out some folks here that had some questions about working with Kate.

55:13
Daniel Scharff
Absolutely. All right, thanks everybody. Enjoy. All right, everybody, thank you so much for listening to our podcast. If you loved it, I would so appreciate it if you could leave us a review. You could do it right now. If you're an Apple podcast, you can scroll to the bottom of our Startup CPG Podcast page and click on Write a review. Leave your company name in there. I will try to read it out. If you're in Spotify, you can click on about and then the star rating icon. If you are a service provider that would like to appear on the Startup CPG podcast, you can email us@partners startupcpg.com lastly, if you found yourself grooving along to the music, it is my band. You can visit our website and listen to more. It is superfantastics.com thank you everybody. See you next.